|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 2, 2015 5:51:57 GMT
Great idea !
|
|
|
Post by Steve Toy on Sept 2, 2015 7:59:01 GMT
We plug it into my MDAC via a standard USB lead. We play a track and my guest is suitably impressed with what he hears. I browse through his catalogue on the screen of his laptop and I pick a track that I know I've got on CD. I then find the CD and play that into the same DAC. "Do you still think the computer sounds as good or better?" "No." The only exceptions to this were when Mark from Item Audio brought round the Aurender X10 and X30 and a PC that he'd built himself but even so, I'd expect a CD transport for the same kind of money as the Aurenders to blow them into the weeds. If you like a dynamically compressed, slightly hard, grainy and 2D presentation of your music get a Sonos. :-D Is this the DAC you're using www.lakewestaudio.com/ ? Did anyone download any drivers for their machine? Going from the information on the Lakewest site the DAC is natively supported by Mac OSX and Linux, and Windows machines need to have ASIO drivers installed. Getting decent results using computers as source is a bit more involved than it might first appear, depending on the operating system and the media players capabilities with respect to using relevant drivers. Then you have the quality of rip to consider - if it's not been securely ripped using a bit perfect ripping tool then who knows how good the rip is. Are we talking MP3 or AAC, ALAC or FLAC? It's a little bit more involved than you might think. Mark from Item Audio demonstrated that even with bit perfection you can squash the dynamics, soundstaging and introduce grain and hardness.The files were all FLAC. The MDAC also has a feature to test for bit perfection anyway. The issue seems to have little to do with the digital side of things at all but with the fact that computers are noisy beasts and this noise finds its way into the analogue domain. For sure, a CD player is essentially a computer but it's a 1982 model designed to do a very specific job and nothing else. A modern PC has a fast processor, a switch-mode power supply and a fan. Without the kind of regulation and other design considerations to reduce or eliminate noise as may be found in equipment designed and made specifically for audio it's going to do some damage, unless of course it has been designed and built specifically for audio purposes itself. I've even tried running a laptop from its batteries here. That actually sounds worse but I've really no idea as to why. My particular MDAC is a forerunner to the MDAC2 project that I'm a paid-up member of. It is one of a number that were extensively modded by John Westlake himself (over 100 component changes from the standard Audiolab model). This one was actually built by him from the ground up in his own lab.
|
|
|
Post by Steve Toy on Sept 2, 2015 8:19:04 GMT
Steve posting on here, whats up? has pink fish imposed their guardianship of audio intelligentsia and all things flat earth to stridently (naimly) upon your good-self? Nice to see you about even after all these years how is life? Just for the record Steve the CD transport and clock the FBA system make a mockery of was pretty close to £40K with the atomic clock. Mind you I believe aos can deliver a world beating FBA system for thrupence ha'penny lad, I just suddenly feel the need for a whippet to thrash while spinning Champagne supernova on me techie 1200 with cotton reel suspension and uber secret bearing material made from the tears of Frost giant's slain at Ragnarok collected by dwarfs with inferiority complexes and forged between the huge gravitation forces generated by an imploding star on a far distant galaxy in another universe. Whist discussing the hoppiness of Hook Norton ale intersperse with bouts of Pat Barber and Natalie Merchant. Hummmmmmmmmmmmmm Niceeeeeeeee Only to be counter opposed by the milling throng support of Sun Ra and Ornette Coleman taking you to places not dissimilar upper corner flat located off the old Kent road circa spring 1968 way beyond groovvy cats............................Nice I feel the need for big tannoys, Macintosh amp a shaggy rug a 70's style 3 bar electric fire and one of those delightful Poirot era lampshade , large mid terraced house with bay windows and local hostelry that is partial for a jazz night and real ale. Feeling a touch frustrated too much desk jockeying If anything, pfm has become too round-earth for my tastes and infected by an army of know-it-all measurebators whose idea of 3D is not the soundstage but the graphs and waterfalls showing their in-room frequency response before and after passive and music-mangling active correction. One guy has 'proven' with measurements that my equipment supports make my system sound worse because they add distortion that I obviously like and actually increase vibration! He didn't actually measure my stand, mind. I think he used a plastic cup or somesuch. Think Zerogain circa 2005, the atmosphere is identical! In terms of forum managememt style this place seems to be a polar opposite to what I'm used to. Here bans are issued as a last resort instead of being dished out arbitrarily and frequently (imho) and in the same manner that a school teacher with serious classroom management issues may hand out detentions and bawl out his/her miscreant kids in front of everyone else. AOS is pleasant enough. It is just the audio equivalent of the Antiques Roadshow. The latest Tannoy GR Kensingtons and Turnberrys sound fantastic, btw, nothing like the big ol' cuddly ones of yore. Unfortunately AudioWorks have had to stop stocking them because none of the Cheshire set are buying them - they don't go with the décor and the blokes up there are all seriously under the thumb so Avalons wth the chiselled slenderness it is, instead.
|
|
|
Post by Stratmangler on Sept 2, 2015 9:29:52 GMT
Mark from Item Audio demonstrated that even with bit perfection you can squash the dynamics, soundstaging and introduce grain and hardness.The files were all FLAC. The MDAC also has a feature to test for bit perfection anyway. The issue seems to have little to do with the digital side of things at all but with the fact that computers are noisy beasts and this noise finds its way into the analogue domain. For sure, a CD player is essentially a computer but it's a 1982 model designed to do a very specific job and nothing else. A modern PC has a fast processor, a switch-mode power supply and a fan. Without the kind of regulation and other design considerations to reduce or eliminate noise as may be found in equipment designed and made specifically for audio it's going to do some damage, unless of course it has been designed and built specifically for audio purposes itself. I've even tried running a laptop from its batteries here. That actually sounds worse but I've really no idea as to why. My particular MDAC is a forerunner to the MDAC2 project that I'm a paid-up member of. It is one of a number that were extensively modded by John Westlake himself (over 100 component changes from the standard Audiolab model). This one was actually built by him from the ground up in his own lab. Your laptop probably sounds worse on battery because the computer hardware isn't receiving sufficient current to drive it properly. I agree with you about the source noise issues - PCs are noisy places. That's why I don't use a normal computer as a regular source. I have my Squeezebox, and it's powered by a decent linear PSU. That is turn connects to my DAC (M2Tech Evo DAC) which is also powered by a decent linear PSU. In my case the SPDIF is a 1.5m Belden/Canare cable from Mark Grant - it's properly up to SPDIF spec, so enough said. So electrical noise isn't an issue - there's no switching noise to consider (no SMPS) and the linear PSUs are very, very quiet. Now I have dabbled with digital recording, and my experiences with computer hardware have also made me very aware of electrical noise. My recording interface is an EMU0404 USB - it's a very flexible device, and it is not powered by USB at all. It requires an external PSU, and when I bought it it was supplied with a SMPS. It's voltage and current requirements are the same as the Squeezebox, so it crossed my mind to try to use the linear PSU with the EMU. I had to cobble together an adapter cable. I was astonished at the lack of noise floor on recording. With the SMPS powering the EMU there was a very low level of audible hash, and the hash all but disappeared with the linear PSU. One thing I will add is that SMPS don't have to be noisy, but to do the job properly costs money, and with the wholesale price of the now all too familiar wall warts being next to sod all most manufacturers just run with them. Companies such as Chord Electronics and Halcro do spend time and money building their own SMPS, and they produce some very fine sounding amplifiers. Graham Slee's Proprius Monobloc amplifiers also utilise SMPS, and they're fine sounding amps too.
|
|
|
Post by MartinT on Sept 3, 2015 14:55:35 GMT
Mind you I believe aos can deliver a world beating FBA system for thrupence ha'penny lad, I just suddenly feel the need for a whippet to thrash while spinning Champagne supernova on me techie 1200 with cotton reel suspension and uber secret bearing material made from the tears of Frost giant's slain at Ragnarok collected by dwarfs with inferiority complexes and forged between the huge gravitation forces generated by an imploding star on a far distant galaxy in another universe. Whist discussing the hoppiness of Hook Norton ale intersperse with bouts of Pat Barber and Natalie Merchant. Hummmmmmmmmmmmmm Niceeeeeeeee I want whatever you're on
|
|
|
Post by MartinT on Sept 3, 2015 14:57:34 GMT
Mark from Item Audio demonstrated that even with bit perfection you can squash the dynamics, soundstaging and introduce grain and hardness. Oh, absolutely. Bit perfection is only half the story, as anyone with ears can ascertain pretty quickly. The timing and clocking of the data is critical to good sound quality.
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 3, 2015 19:20:00 GMT
Downloading Tidal now, I'll give it a spin tonight
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 3, 2015 19:46:33 GMT
Ive quickly hit a small snag, I use my laptop as my main sourse, I have Tidal downloaded to my MacBook Pro and my iPad, and I can't seem to Tidal on my MacBook from Tidal on my iPad, any suggestions? Google doesnt seem to be much help
|
|
|
Post by John on Sept 3, 2015 19:55:10 GMT
Maybe there is a youtube video tutorial
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 3, 2015 20:13:00 GMT
Not that I can find, not to worry I'll figure it out. Tidal certainly is different, listening to Dire Staits communique. A lot more precise or crisp treble, a greater air to the sound, more forward and bass a bit tighter, is it better? To early to tell, but my initial thoughts are no. Sounds a bit too strident to me as to much of an edge to it, HOWEVER I am only able to listen to normal Tidal, not Tidal Hifi as I see I have to download Google Chrome. I'm hesitant to do this as I usually run from Apples Safari as it works well for me. Spotify Pemium to my ears is a lot more natural and CD like, the difference between ripped CD and Spotify Premium is small. Give me a few days and I'll see if I can start playing music through Google Chrome
|
|
|
Post by Greg on Sept 3, 2015 20:25:47 GMT
Try what I use and download ickStream to facilitate Tidal. Works for me
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 3, 2015 20:38:42 GMT
Thanks Greg, is that to download on the MacBook Pro laptop or iPad ?
|
|
|
Post by Nick on Sept 4, 2015 4:02:50 GMT
Ive quickly hit a small snag, I use my laptop as my main sourse, I have Tidal downloaded to my MacBook Pro and my iPad, and I can't seem to Tidal on my MacBook from Tidal on my iPad, any suggestions? Google doesnt seem to be much help Sorry but this statement does not seem to make any sense what connection are you trying to achieve?
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 4, 2015 6:14:53 GMT
Ive quickly hit a small snag, I use my laptop as my main sourse, I have Tidal downloaded to my MacBook Pro and my iPad, and I can't seem to Tidal on my MacBook from Tidal on my iPad, any suggestions? Google doesnt seem to be much help Sorry but this statement does not seem to make any sense what connection are you trying to achieve? Hi nrb I use either iTunes or spotify to play music from my laptop, I also have the app downloaded on my iPad so I'm able to control my laptop from my 'Hifi chair' , much like a remote control would control your TV from the couch in the living room. Tidal doesn't seem to have that facility, not that I can see so far.
|
|
|
Post by MartinT on Sept 4, 2015 6:17:26 GMT
Can you not use any generic remote control app to control the Mac from the iPad?
|
|
|
Post by Stratmangler on Sept 4, 2015 6:41:01 GMT
Gregg's setup utilises Logitech Media Server (LMS). It in turn has ickstream enabled. His player is working as a Squeezebox client connected to LMS, so chances are he's using Squeezelite or Squeezeplay on the device actually doing the rendering. As far as using an iPad as a remote control is concerned there is an official Logitech Squeezebox Controller app and that is free. You don't even need to use the Controller app, because you can control LMS and any device connected to it from any web browser using a http:// address.
Now there are Mac OS versions of LMS, and there may be versions of Squeezelite/Squeezeplay that also run on Mac, so you should be able to set up server and client on your Mac and use the iPad to control it all.
All the software is free, because it's Squeezebox Community written.
|
|
|
Post by Sovereign on Sept 4, 2015 7:20:07 GMT
Thanks chaps
|
|
|
Post by jandl100 on Sept 4, 2015 7:25:41 GMT
Tidal sounds just fine on my setup compared to my CD source. If the sound is bright, look elsewhere for the problem. And golly gosh - all these apps, ickstreams and LMSes - you folks do make things difficult for yourselves!
|
|
|
Post by Stratmangler on Sept 4, 2015 7:49:07 GMT
you folks do make things difficult for yourselves! Not really. Once it's all set up and running it should provide a more pleasurable user experience. It should mean less getting up off one's backside to go and fiddle with the 'puter. And it's educayshunal. There's 'puter networking to be learned in the process.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2015 8:16:56 GMT
Bit perfect playback in a marketing concept and used by IT 'wizards' claiming their is no difference in playback quality simply as 1's are 1's and 0's are 0's.
Why not consider if valves can fully exploit the full potential of the higher resolution formats?
|
|