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digititis
Sept 25, 2019 8:11:16 GMT
via mobile
Post by julesd68 on Sept 25, 2019 8:11:16 GMT
The point is to try it both ways and see. My DAC has direct volume control and I tried it straight to my power amp. The resulting sound was too bright and lacked weight. Through the preamp with the DAC set at full output (bypass) it sounds much fuller with greater weight. That's a different situation as your preamp is active of course whereas mine appears to be functionless in the new set up - I don't even need the extra inputs. |
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digititis
Sept 25, 2019 8:12:56 GMT
via mobile
Post by julesd68 on Sept 25, 2019 8:12:56 GMT
I use the Topping volume control and it works well in my system. I have quite sensitive speakers so adding extra gain means it is very hard to control volume levels It certainly worth trying Jules That's good John, will give it a try. It would free up some space for a new power amp on the rack. |
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 25, 2019 8:19:00 GMT
All depends whether the pre section of the DAC is not that great, it probably isn't compared to the passive.
So as long as you really can bypass the DAC volume control, and not end up going through both, then you should get a more transparent sound with the RVC.
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Post by MartinT on Sept 25, 2019 8:47:53 GMT
That's a different situation as your preamp is active of course whereas mine appears to be functionless in the new set up - I don't even need the extra inputs. Yep, I can see how eliminating your passive pre would probably be beneficial. |
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 25, 2019 20:58:55 GMT
All depends whether the pre section of the DAC is not that great, it probably isn't compared to the passive. So as long as you really can bypass the DAC volume control, and not end up going through both, then you should get a more transparent sound with the RVC. Thanks Jerry, I hadn't considered that ... |
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Post by John on Sept 26, 2019 5:13:51 GMT
I have no transparency issues in my system with the D70 volume control
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Post by MartinT on Sept 26, 2019 5:48:01 GMT
It really does vary. In my case, the Pass preamp has such welly on its output that it drives the Belles power amp into submission with real potency to the sound. Using the DAC directly, that potency is lost. There is no real difference in transparency, as the Pass is like wire with gain in its treatment of the signal.
I would have far preferred the LKS to drive the power amp well as I could have simplified the system and sold the Pass!
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Post by John on Sept 26, 2019 6:35:02 GMT
Agree but think in Jules case it sounds like he does not need the extra gain
This is so system dependent
Certainly, worth a try, however Jerry might be right that the preamp is helping your system
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 26, 2019 7:15:07 GMT
I have no transparency issues in my system with the D70 volume control Well, there is always room for improvement, in any system. And it's a freebie for Jules if he can manage to bypass the D70 volume control to good effect by using the RVC. The RVC passive is a remarkably transparent device, it may well be noticably better than the D70's volume control. Does anyone know if the D70 volume control can be bypassed? Putting it up to max might help but would probably still leave it in the signal path. Looking at Topping's techie blurb ... "The D70 also acts as a preamplifier since it includes a volume controller with attenuation from -99dB to 0dB. However, this volume control function can be disabled so that the D70 can only be used as a DAC with output levels constantly at their maximums, i.e. 4Vrms for XLR output and 2Vrms for RCA output." That looks hopeful for a genuine bypass. If the D70 volume control works digitally, quiet [high attenuation] playback may well have distinct benefits if bypassed with an analog pre. It would be interesting to try it. |
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Post by John on Sept 26, 2019 7:51:31 GMT
It is one of those things you have to try in the context of your own system and let your ears decide
No volume bypass on the D70 so Jules need to have the volume on max if using a preamp
Be aware that the D70 does not measure as well on maximum volume so a reasonable chance this might be a backward step
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 26, 2019 7:58:28 GMT
I'm not sure if 'this volume control function can be disabled' means a genuine bypass or not.
If not, you can set the volume level to whatever you wish, so maybe setting it to where the D70 measures best would work well with the TVC?
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Post by MartinT on Sept 26, 2019 9:02:56 GMT
In the LKS, you can leave the volume at 0dB or set the bypass on which fixes it. At the DAC chip level, it should be the same thing, at least for the ES9038 chipset. Since 0dB means there is never any data being lost*, it should always sound best regardless of how it measures (which would probably be noise rather than waveform integrity measurements).
I'm guessing the AKM works similarly although I don't know if it performs volume function directly.
* it depends on what word length the DAC uses internally. If 32-bit, you're not going to lose data until listening at very low volumes.
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Post by John on Sept 26, 2019 9:03:11 GMT
Yes that should work. A good few options to try
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 26, 2019 9:26:36 GMT
It is one of those things you have to try in the context of your own system and let your ears decide No volume bypass on the D70 so Jules need to have the volume on max if using a preamp At the moment I can confirm that I'm using 'DAC mode' which is selectable in settings - this simply means that the volume is non-adjustable. It certainly works superbly well, but I will have a go at using the DAC with its volume control. |
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 26, 2019 12:50:20 GMT
I have just taken delivery of a pair of BOSC mono blocks.  I asked Leo (designer, Orchard Audio) if I could have a listen as I thought the gallium nitride tech looked interesting and he kindly agreed, so many thanks to SNR&THD for the loan. I will be posting my findings once I have had a good listen and had a chance to compare them to a couple of other power amps in my possession. |
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Post by SNR&THD on Sept 26, 2019 21:22:27 GMT
I have just taken delivery of a pair of BOSC mono blocks. I asked Leo (designer, Orchard Audio) if I could have a listen as I thought the gallium nitride tech looked interesting and he kindly agreed, so many thanks to SNR&THD for the loan. I will be posting my findings once I have had a good listen and had a chance to compare them to a couple of other power amps in my possession. My pleasure, looking forward to your findings. |
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 27, 2019 12:59:56 GMT
I can now confirm that I prefer using the RVC than going DAC direct.
More body to the sound and also I have more control over the volume.
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 27, 2019 13:13:38 GMT
My general experience of this sort of hi-tech wonderDAC with variable output is that they sound a bit thin and sterile going directly to a power amp.
Jules' observation rather knocks on the head the suspicion that an active pre is needed, as he isn't using one!
But something a bit odd is generally going on with these devices imo.
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 27, 2019 13:19:31 GMT
Well the D70 is sounding absolutely spiffing - everything I hoped it would be.
But I have a very annoying issue with spotify playback - when listening to something like The Firebird, it is made up of lots of individual 'tracks' but is meant to play back seamlessly.
However I'm getting an audio drop out at the end of every track which is very annoying.
Is this a DAC or spotify or volumio issue?
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Post by MartinT on Sept 27, 2019 13:35:31 GMT
Not the DAC - it just does as it's told.
If I play a whole album in Volumio from Spotify or Qobuz it gives me gapless streaming. Pick tracks, though, and there is a gap between each one.
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