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Post by julesd68 on Nov 20, 2018 13:03:10 GMT
Look forward to your thoughts on that one Martin.
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Post by MartinT on Nov 29, 2018 7:43:46 GMT
My son came over for the day yesterday. He is an amateur music composer and has a good pair of analytical ears. I gave him a task as I was interested in his views.
I played him Dreamer from Supertramp's Crime of the Century remastered album. First I played him the Spotify HQ version and then I played the Qobuz 24/192 version. His opinion agreed with mine in that the differences are not as stark as you might expect. In fact, we both agreed that the Spotify version sounded excellent and the Qobuz stream only pulled away in one area. That is in the area of separation. Not left/right separation but being able to listen to every strand of the music, each instrument or effect, without the very slight blending that Spotify introduces. We were especially listening to the vocal treatment and the recording's acoustic.
There are a disappointing number of hi-res versions of albums that I like so I still struggle to justify having the Qobuz HiFi service. I'll persevere, but right now it's annoying that many albums that I know to exist in hi-res versions (e.g. Brothers in Arms or Dark Side of the Moon) are only in 16/44 on Qobuz.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2018 9:16:18 GMT
Very interesting findings, so why persist with Qobuz when Spotify has a larger library of music anyway, doesn't it?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2018 9:17:50 GMT
I have mentioned this before, also Qobuz does have a specific sound ala' Tidal, the correct equivalent files are absolutely head and shoulders above the streaming services currently.
However I have noticed even with Spotify they have a tendency to favor remastered albums more, along with more average sounding original CD copies. Yes they are more and more really nicely sounding albums out there.
One area that does make a difference with high resolution mater streaming is the processing power of the unit which is performing the decoding imho
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Post by jandl100 on Nov 29, 2018 10:03:27 GMT
Very interesting findings, so why persist with Qobuz when Spotify has a larger library of music anyway, doesn't it? Addressing the point in general, rather than MartinT-specific, it's because with most systems Qobuz 16/44 sounds a fair bit better than Spotify Premium! Some folks don't even regard Spotify Premium as high fidelity. I have no idea what magic Martin has worked to make them effectively equivalent, but I think you'll find that in most systems Qobuz is significantly better sounding. As mentioned previously, the results you get from these streaming services are amazingly system-dependent. Also, while Spotify has a larger music library, Qobuz (and Tidal etc) do have a lot of material that Spotify (at the moment) lacks. There are several classical recording labels, for example, available on Qobuz but not Spotify. I'm sure that must be the case for other genres. So to get the max music, you do need both! |
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Post by John on Nov 29, 2018 10:15:01 GMT
I used to be one of those that saw Spotify as just good for discovering music. Perhaps with better decoding I could get more from Tidal but to be honest very happy with just how much access to music and quality of playback I get from Spotify
A happy convert
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Post by MartinT on Nov 29, 2018 10:15:35 GMT
As mentioned previously, the results you get from these streaming services are amazingly system-dependent. I do agree and I try not to make my findings sound universal. For me, Spotify continues to amaze and Qobuz is only a little ahead with hi-res, and almost indistinguishable with 16/44, material. I will stick with Qobuz for the time being, but it depends on being able to use Qobuz Connect in Volumio (which is currently broken) so that I can start building my playlists to match those I have on Spotify. |
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Post by MartinT on Nov 29, 2018 10:22:09 GMT
However I have noticed even with Spotify they have a tendency to favor remastered albums more, along with more average sounding original CD copies. Yes they are more and more really nicely sounding albums out there. It's a shame that you often don't have a choice. For instance... Jennifer Warnes Famous Blue Raincoat 20th Anniversary Edition (mastered by Bernie Grundman) on Spotify sounds magnificent ...the original (exceedingly flat and lifeless) version is no longer there Supertramp Crime of the Century (Remastered) on Spotify sounds fine and is the same as the hi-res version on Qobuz ...does not sound as good as the original mastering from memory, but the original is no longer there I suspect there may be licencing and/or storage issues or even confusion in keeping all versions. |
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Post by Slinger on Nov 29, 2018 14:12:00 GMT
It's only us nutters that have six or seven versions of the same album, Martin. If the streaming companies were run by music lovers, and not bean counters, perhaps there might be more choices devoted to the different pressings.
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Post by Clive on Nov 29, 2018 14:45:47 GMT
However I have noticed even with Spotify they have a tendency to favor remastered albums more, along with more average sounding original CD copies. Yes they are more and more really nicely sounding albums out there. Jennifer Warnes Famous Blue Raincoat 20th Anniversary Edition (mastered by Bernie Grundman) on Spotify sounds magnificent ...the original (exceedingly flat and lifeless) version is no longer there That's interesting. I only listen to this album on vinyl, indeed it's one of the references I frequently use. It does need the volume turning up as it's mastered at a low level however I wonder if the original CD transfer was poorly done. |
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Post by MartinT on Nov 29, 2018 14:50:17 GMT
Yes, my original vinyl sounded excellent but the original CD (which I have) is poor. I also have the 20th Anniversary CD to compare with. And Spotify, of course.
I must look at what Qobuz offer. It's such a perfect performance and a very good recording that it's worth hearing in all its splendour.
She has one of those perfect 10/10 voices, in the same category as k d lang and Sarah McLachlan. Who else could have had Leonard Cohen guesting on their album?
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Post by jandl100 on Nov 29, 2018 16:04:11 GMT
Blue Raincoat? My god. I was irritated by it on 1st listen and thoroughly sick of it by the 3rd.   |
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Post by Slinger on Nov 29, 2018 16:25:22 GMT
...Who else could have had Leonard Cohen guesting on their album?  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2018 16:40:37 GMT
I have sat through this bloody album more times than I could sit through a Naim system, one of the down falls of being an Audio consultant  |
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Post by John on Nov 29, 2018 17:16:37 GMT
Well I usually make people listen to a mix of Dream Theater Surinder Sandhu and some jazz
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2018 18:40:18 GMT
I have sat through this bloody album more times than I could sit through a Naim system, one of the down falls of being an Audio consultant What you going on about, it's one of my favourite Elton John albums! Oh actually think you might be talking about the Jennifer Warnes album, LOL. |
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Post by MartinT on Nov 29, 2018 20:06:58 GMT
What can I say, I love a great female voice!
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Post by The Brookmeister on Nov 30, 2018 20:44:11 GMT
So many of you listen to spotify/tidal/qobiz whatever as your main source for music?
Really?
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Post by MartinT on Nov 30, 2018 22:08:33 GMT
Andrew of SGS contacted me asking for my preference for the earthing post for the Signature I've ordered. I've chosen copper over his recommended rhodium as I went right off the latter for accentuating the edges in music. I'd rather not reintroduce rhodium into my system now.
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Post by MartinT on Dec 3, 2018 21:02:43 GMT
I'm finished with comparing Spotify HQ against Qobuz 16/44 as there is little if any difference between them. So let's stretch Qobuz into hi-res territory, which is why I'm subscribing to it after all.
Alt-J: Breezeblocks
The 24/96 version of An Awesome Wave is of demo quality and shows off hi-res well. There's a lot of percussion and vocals in this song and Qobuz pulls away from Spotify in the percussive detail and its sheer potency.
Lorde: Tennis Court
The 24/48 version barely pulls away from the Spotify stream. There is only the tiniest bit of extra leading edge to the hi-res stream.
Brandi Carlile: The Joke
Spotify holds this severe test together remarkably well. The 24/96 version is just a little more dynamic with the piano in the beginning and soars when she lets rip. On both versions, distortion sets in towards the extremely busy end, suggesting the the engineer pushed the levels a bit too much. Still a cracking performance by Brandi.
Supertramp: Bloody Well Right
The Spotify version of the remaster is really good, with the electric piano at the beginning very clear and dynamic. The 24/192 stream has even more definition in the piano and the drums come in with more clout. There's also a crash cymbal stage right that is well picked out. In this instance, the 180g vinyl sounds better than either with considerably welly and attack.
Pink Floyd: Wearing the Inside Out
Here the 24/96 version pulls away in the definition and rasp of the sax. The most obvious difference of all my comparisons so far.
Jeff Beck: Scared for the Children
This is another great track with huge attack in the guitar, crystal clear vocals from Rosie Bones and deep bass tremors. The 24/44 stream is just a little more defined in the string plucking, but otherwise it's similar.
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