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Post by julesd68 on Mar 1, 2023 13:13:49 GMT
Mahler 9 (live)
Simon Rattle & Symphonieorchester des Bayerischen Rundfunks (2022)
This month I thought we could revisit Mahler 9 with a new live recording from Simon Rattle and the Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra.
Normally I would give such a recording an extra wide berth, but I was alerted to this by the estimable Mr Dave Hurwitz who was shocked to find that it bucks the invariably soporific trend in Rattle releases and is in fact rather excellent. All the maestro needs now is a new concert hall! 
I have also read elsewhere that the recording quality is superb.
Over to you.
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Post by MartinT on Mar 1, 2023 19:21:16 GMT
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Post by MartinT on Mar 1, 2023 19:42:05 GMT
Rattle's live concerts, the ones I've been to, have been consistently excellent and his Mahler 2 the most stupendous classical concert I've ever been to. Just why his recordings are so sleep-inducing is a mystery, but I do wonder if the BPO have something to do with it. This recording is very much better because it's live, and I think he performs better to an audience. However, I've had a few head shaking moments listening to this. Where is the turmoil and angst of a man dying while writing his 9th, and trying his best to avoid naming it the 9th because it was the final symphony of a few famous composers? It sounds to me like Mahler 9 Lite, albeit with very good sound and performance. I've been spoiled for years as I listened to the truly stupendous Barbirolli recording. This is Earth shattering in its intensity, a performance that leaves me desolate in its wake. It is exactly how music should portray death. For the Rattle, 3/5. This is what Mahler 9 should sound like:  |
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 1, 2023 20:40:04 GMT
I must say that the Berlin Phil with Petrenko are a profoundly different proposition to Rattle at least in the concerts I've been to.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 1, 2023 20:40:47 GMT
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Post by MartinT on Mar 1, 2023 21:07:46 GMT
It's up to the listener, but I don't see the musical performance as being different, just its interpretation. I still don't like Rattle's Mahler Lite, as it removes the power of the music whether it be catastrophe or life-force.
I do judge 9ths by the first movement, as with his 2nd. It must hang together and be an emotional journey as that is undoubtedly what Mahler wanted. That Rattle 2nd I heard live was utterly overwhelmingly powerful, so there is no doubt that he can do it. But not here.
Do try the Barbirolli / BPO if you can. It's a bit old now but still a fine recording and the performance is one to remember.
By the way, The Guardian lists Norrington as one of the Five Key Recordings. Way to go to have me treat the list with contempt.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 1, 2023 21:21:26 GMT
It's up to the listener, but I don't see the musical performance as being different, just its interpretation. I still don't like Rattle's Mahler Lite, as it removes the power of the music whether it be catastrophe or life-force. I do judge 9ths by the first movement, as with his 2nd. It must hang together and be an emotional journey as that is undoubtedly what Mahler wanted. That Rattle 2nd I heard live was utterly overwhelmingly powerful, so there is no doubt that he can do it. But not here. Do try the Barbirolli / BPO if you can. It's a bit old now but still a fine recording and the performance is one to remember. By the way, The Guardian lists Norrington as one of the Five Key Recordings. Way to go to have me treat the list with contempt. Interesting thoughts Martin! Ha - thought you would like Norrington in there. To be fair they did suggest it would be 'marmite' ... I'm not going to listen to Rattle just yet, I have a little more prep work to do ...  |
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 1, 2023 23:31:49 GMT
As always a Hurwitz survey is both entertaining and informative!
Gets properly stuck into the Bernstein and Bruno Walter 'Guardian Favourites'. Sadly only a brief mention of Norrington...
Also interesting in ideas about the range of interpretations.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 3, 2023 13:57:29 GMT
Here's a bit of a stream of consciousness about what this symphony might mean, and what is suggests to me after earlier listening to the Chailly recording of this work. We know the symphony starts in a major key and ends in a minor key - that tells its own story of which Mahler's death is the focus. But listening to the work as a whole it seems we are about to lose something much bigger than one life. There's so much in the work that sounds positive but more than that, almost sentimental. I sense huge elements of nostalgia in some of the "sweet" themes and dances, and at the end of the symphony there's the sense that we are about to lose all that we know and love. This might be a number of things. The strongest for me is a loss of innocence, reflected on the work's deep nostalgia and the thought that we are heading for darker times. Could it signal the death of Western culture? The ending also seems more than poignant with the Great War just a few years away which would take millions of young men's lives. We can only see this with hindsight of course, and possibly the work isn't prophetic in this regard but you can't help but notice it. There's also the possibility that the work could partly be a Requiem for the imminent loss of tonality in classical music - the destruction of many of the memorable, tuneful and naive themes in the work. So many strands of thought come together on one symphony and it's difficult to dismiss anything out of hand, which makes the work so fascinating for me. But the long ending of the work seems peaceful and serene at times (especially with Chailly) and it's difficult to know how to integrate this into one's overall thoughts of the work. Rattle next ...
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Post by MartinT on Mar 3, 2023 15:33:41 GMT
I agree with your sentiments about the different possible meanings behind the work, and I do think it signifies 'loss' whether that be one person or an era. I feel the sense of loss in the 9th very strongly and it's not just focused on one thing. For me, I could not play Mahler for a number of years after the loss of my wife. His music is just too close to the heart. From that point of view, it conveys his emotions very powerfully.
I think the serenity at the end speaks to me as a peaceful termination. The end of life and its stresses. Peace at last, even if at the cost of not knowing it.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 3, 2023 17:02:46 GMT
I can appreciate that entirely Martin.
Chailly's reading of the final movement is one of the 'broadest' recordings of all, weighing in at 28'27"! In this way he strongly reinforces the idea of a slow final breath, peace and serenity. It's beautifully handled.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 4, 2023 0:20:26 GMT
So, Rattle here we go!
First thing I notice is the lovely acoustic which is beautifully open and spacious. Resolution sounds fantastic even on my modest headphones.
The opening (and recurring) theme is sweetly observed without overdosing on the saccharine. Really powerful dynamics when it starts to get dark, and energetic, purposeful playing from the BRSO. Strings sound lush yet cut through well. In fact all the instruments have wonderful separation and definition, I feel like I'm enjoying musicianship of the highest quality in every department. A stark tension prevailing in this taut performance and thus far I'm enjoying the tempo. Rattle is a full 10 mins quicker than Chailly over the whole work! My favourite part of this movement is 20-22 to 20-54 as those strings are utterly seductive and ravishing; I felt myself being hurtled back through the 20th century. With this live recording I have this real sense of a living, breathing work, not just a recording. Chailly manages to drop the ball a couple of times in this movement and allowed my attention to wander, whereas I'm all in for this recording so far.
Loving the string attack and clipped rhythms in the second for the Ländler! Gives it great shape. Gosh this is a fine outfit, really. The timpani and percussion really plumb the frequency depths in this recording, it's absolutely remarkable. The surge in energy from 10-52 to 11-52 is just gorgeous ... and the delicate work fraught with danger for the horns (nowhere to hide) at the end of the movement is perfectly observed.
The Rondo-Burlesque commences like a shot in the arm. Found it difficult not to tap my toes along here ... And when the tempo subsides there's more luscious strings to indulge in. Some most exotic bravura woodwind on display too! And when the tempo picks up again, whoosh, buckle up, off we go! Sparks fly.
And so, the long finale, here clocking in at 23-59, 4-28 quicker than Chailly. The first six minutes or so I'm not quite at ease with the brisk tempo but after that I attune to it as the intensity of the music increases. Love the languid violin, flute and oboe solos here and the radiance of the massed tone as a whole. I would happily have listened to a broader tempo to extract even more emotion from this movement but fortunately Rattle slows things down to preserve the shattering impact of the ending.
No one account will be perfect but overall I have to score this 5* Well Rattle Me!!
And nobody was more surprised than me ...
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Post by MartinT on Mar 4, 2023 10:40:47 GMT
Huh - wildly different opinions, then.
I don't think I'll be listening to the Rattle again.
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 4, 2023 11:01:08 GMT
That's fine Martin - I'm not trying to convert anyone to this recording, just my own feelings as it gave me a great deal of pleasure, even on headphones. 
I'm not saying it's top of the tree but I find it a very balanced reading. Of course I'm sure there are better out there, especially ones that go deeper but I'll definitely play it on the system when I can in addition to the Barbirolli. |
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Post by julesd68 on Mar 13, 2023 20:32:21 GMT
Nobody else care to join us for some Mahler?? Here's another highly rated recent 9 by Ivan Fischer that I will be tucking into before long. |
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 16, 2023 4:49:08 GMT
Nobody else care to join us for some Mahler?? I'll be along shortly. Well, it'll he a while.... Just started listening to this Rattle recording and I'm hugely surprised. The opening is superbly done. Deeply tentative and surgingly romantic. What he's doing with the pacing of the initial sections is mind-whirling. Wow. |
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 16, 2023 12:14:12 GMT
Lol - I'm actually going to have to take notice of his future recordings now. I hope it's not a one off!
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Post by jandl100 on Sept 25, 2023 8:02:55 GMT
Yes, OK, I did enjoy the whole performance.
The opening was best, 5/5, and it then settled down to a thoroughly decent conventional 4/5.
No great depths plumbed in the finale, I felt.
But, yes, Sir Simon seems to be coming of age.
4/5
Inspired and surprised by this thoroughly decent performance, I'm now playing SR's very recently released LSO Bruckner 7.
It's going very nicely so far!
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Post by julesd68 on Sept 25, 2023 11:09:14 GMT
I didn't dare see anything he did with the LSO previously but have booked for a concert in January.
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