That's a complete denial of the reality - it's an image of cloud cuckoo land where animals are just happily leaping about and suddenly die, say with a bullet to the back of their head (using the example from the video) and had lived a long and happy life. The reality is that most animals suffer before becoming meat on your plate, many terribly. So either you are denying yourself the realisation that you're causing suffering for your own pleasure (not survival - neither you nor your family need meat to live healthily) or do realise but you just don't give a shit..

I don't have a problem with people eating meat per se, just with the reality of how they are treated and how and when that death comes about when completely unnecessary. I wouldn't have a problem eating say road kill but I'd probably choose not to as I still would have no reason other than trivial pleasure (if in fact tasty) - I'd rather leave it for other animals to genuinely survive on.  Neither would I hunt or kill unless for my own genuine survival.


Yes, I do choose to eat because I wish to survive and that includes vegetables. I choose NOT to eat meat because I don't wish to cause suffering of animals.
 
You do NOT eat meat to survive (because we can all survive perfectly well without meat). You choose to eat meat DESPITE the suffering it will cause.

There IS a moral component to the different choices you and I make, they are not simple equivalents.


  Better to just blame societal norms and not having thought about it much rather than make justifications, I think anyway, else you start to dig yourself a moral hole, start to sound like you don't give a shit about anything.

  Of course there is a self-centred component to my choice too; I gain more enjoyment from living animals than I ever do from dead animals. That is increased by knowing truthfully that I mean them absolutely no harm when I interact with them.

 

Whereas you start to sound a bit holier-than-thou. There is, of course, the point that the vast majority of farm animals simply wouldn't exist at all if we stopped eating meat, which gives rise to all sorts of moral conundrums

Indeed, which is what I am railing against. Please note ID that not once have I suggested that you should eat meat, neither have I cast aspersions on your character due to your lifestyle and that is because I respect freedom of choice, therefore kindly return the favour.

  (this to both dvh and Dave)

  As a thought experiment, imagine you were back in the days of the slave trade and you were arguing against slavery whilst everyone around you was either actively for it or not bothered and happy with the results of cheap labour.

  Imagine you know that a local slave has been beaten to within an inch of their lives for breaking a glass and no-one is speaking out about that cruelty, no-one appears to care and many even congratulate the perpetrator for keeping the slaves in their place, maintain the situation.

  In that environment, if you speak out about the beating and slavery as a whole aren't you naturally going to be called "holier-than-thou" ? Aren't you going to face accusations of thinking you are morally superior? What's the alternative? The alternative is to capitulate and stay silent, let the slave trade continue out of fear of personal criticism.

  Wouldn't that be the worst kind of cowardice, against everything we celebrate in heros of the past and of our time?   (People did speak out, slavery was abolished and we've moved on morally as a society. )


  So please think before you liberally accuse someone else of being "holier-than-thou" - that feeling is YOUR feeling when confronted by an alternative moral position. If your own moral position is strong and confident then why should there even be a hint of moral superiority being imposed? If you have your own doubts about the status quo deep down then at least examine those doubts ... life's too short for pride and an "I'm not going to be told what to do!" attitude IMHO.

haha, sponsored by McDonalds.

I'd come at it from the health angle - Red meat yes, couple of times a week. Anything with Sodium Nitrate / Nitrite added to it - No.
Smoked stuff - No, not regularly.

Let's think, millions of years of evolution culminating in us being hunter gatherers vs. settling, eating refined grains, carbs and sugars that we are utterly not designed for. Still love a pie, roasties and occasional chocolate though.

If want to talk about toxic food wheat is pretty bad

Trust me I'm a Doctor is back

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b04m0bt4/trust-me-im-a-doctor-series-2-episode-1

More of the same I guess.
10-15 minutes of useful stuff with 45-50 minutes of padding and walking to camera