|
|
Post by John on Aug 6, 2014 6:39:56 GMT
A lot of believe getting the best out your rooms and matching the speakers for this is the best way to get the best out of your sound system
How have you gone about this
|
|
|
|
Post by MartinT on Aug 6, 2014 8:07:34 GMT
I just summarised it for the other thread:
System & speaker positioning, setting the ideal listening position
My speakers are large, so they are closer to the rear wall than I would ideally like. Firing across a room has always sounded better to me than firing down its length. I toe them in so that I can just see the inside faces. My listening position is on a sofa across the room, with its back to the rear wall. I sit with my ears just a little lower than the midrange driver.
Room treatment - reducing flutter echo, bass modes, early reflections, harshness
Carpeted room with soft furnishings and many CD towers to break up exposed wall faces. No exposed windows - venetian blinds break up the large surface. Four TubeTraps, one in each corner, tuned for maximum absorption. One SubTrap at rear left corner. Three PicturePanels, one behind each speaker and one behind my head at my listening position. Small silk rugs on walls. Speaker ports stuffed to reduce bass enhancement.
|
|
|
|
Post by ChrisB on Aug 6, 2014 9:07:16 GMT
Here's my method for finding speaker placement....
Bass
In particular, listen to the bass - you should expect to hear differences in both quality and quantity depending on the position in relation to the rear wall. As you move them out you will reach a point where the balance of the bass weight & bass definition seem most correct to you.
Put 2 pieces of tape on the floor at the corner of each speaker (say the front / inside corner) in an 'L' - shape to define the placement so you can find it again when you need it.
Soundstage
Now do the same exercise, but this time listen out for changes to the soundstage. You'll find that the soundstage becomes deeper, the further away the speakers are from the wall. However, there will probably be a position when the soundstage begins to lose its 'focus'. This is easier for you to spot, than it is for me to describe, but you will know what I mean when you hear it!!
Again you will then be able to identify the optimum spot for this parameter - mark this with more tape. You now have what I think of as the 2 'polar positions'. Somewhere on or between these two, will be the perfect spot - but you'll find that later.
Image
Now, leaving the speakers in the last position, try adjusting the toe-in. This is the angle at which they present themselves to the room (& your ears). Start off by just facing them straight out into the room at 90 degrees to the rear wall. Now compare this to a situation where each box has it's axis crossing at a point just behind you head. The easiest way to do this is to place them so you can just see the faces of the inside walls of each cabinet (in the case of 'boat-tailed' speakers, you need to be seeing equal portions of perhaps the front 1/5th of the cabinet walls).
Now listen & compare the two sounds you're hearing. You should hear differences in the sharpness of the sound & also your ability to hear what the different instruments are doing will be affected. There may be a further change to the soundstage definition and width and it will affect the relative positions of the players upon it. If you then play about with the degrees of toe in you'll find one where it all seems to snap into place.
If you notice a slight loss of clarity with the toe-in, then try moving them slightly further apart.
Now go back to finding your optimum position between the polars.
I've found that working systematically to this method is the easiest way of getting the basics right. The fine tuning is the tricky, time consuming part, where you're moving things in tiny increments.
I like to live with them in what I think is about right for an extended period (a couple of weeks or more) before I get down to the real fine tuning stuff.
|
|
|
|
Post by John on Aug 6, 2014 11:08:49 GMT
I have a similar approach to Chris
One of my biggest room issues was 2nd reflections that made my treble pretty tough to deal with. Using felt around the treble helped alot
When I moved to open baffles one of major thoughts was to remove this hence may figure 8 design
the first bit is to quickly qualify where the speaker starts to sound on song i then start to alter width and toe in. Like Chris i give time to settle with the sound and then make slight adjustments
|
|
|
|
Post by John on Aug 6, 2014 11:10:25 GMT
I would also like to add that getting this right makes a huge difference to sound
|
|
|
|
Post by MartinT on Aug 6, 2014 12:02:39 GMT
Chris said it. Good process description.
|
|
|
|
Post by ChrisB on Aug 11, 2014 8:18:05 GMT
|
|
Paul
Rank: Trio
Posts: 157 
|
Post by Paul on Aug 19, 2014 22:19:39 GMT
With regards to speakers, I've yet to try this suggested elsewhere. Decoupling my speaker stands from the floor (suspended wooden floor) so no spikes and on a slab of something, then coupling the speakers to the stands (blu-tack) or whatnot.
|
|
|
|
Post by John on Aug 20, 2014 4:38:17 GMT
When I had stand mounts I used computer mats to decouple for the stands and that seemed to help the sound
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 20, 2014 4:44:11 GMT
I've had to go about this arse about face to a degree as our listening room is our bedroom out of necessity and there is only one position in the room where speakers can be placed and it is far from ideal. The maximum distance they can be from the wall to the rear is around a foot and from side walls about two and a half feet. This makes things particularly difficult and may help explain why we have been through so many speakers over the past five years. Rear ported designs are generally a no go as they tend to boom due to their proximity to the rear wall. Out of the many speakers that have come and gone only four have really cut the mustard in here. listed in order of effectiveness: 3rd - Art Skibo's, Joint 2nd - Mission 760i/Acoustic Solution AV21's, 1st - B&W DM2's (which don't appear to give a hoot where they sit). Another factor which affects things mightily is that the ONLY effective listening position in the room is to be had sat on the bed with back to headboard. I am expecting some fascinating comments...  |
|
|
|
Post by John on Aug 20, 2014 4:50:40 GMT
Its a reality a lot of people face in the UK Dave
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 20, 2014 4:58:37 GMT
Its a reality a lot of people face in the UK Dave Firstly for those who don't know, we have a son (stepson in my case) who has ADHD and Autism. I've found that these two conditions aren't generally compatible with expensive hifi equipment which is why ours is not located in our otherwise wonderfully suitable living room. Secondly, finding a speaker system which delivers a balanced presentation when the back of ones head is only inches from a wall has been - How can I put this? - educational...  |
|
|
|
Post by John on Aug 20, 2014 5:11:59 GMT
I work with Autism can be pretty demanding
|
|
|
|
Post by MikeMusic on Aug 20, 2014 8:24:21 GMT
New Scientist had a great article that opened up my mind to autism, "Auties".
As with most things there are massively different types and the view I can agree with is that some are just *super* sensitive to various aspect of life.
Finding the overloads can help, but it sounds massively complicated and rarely if ever the same in one person as another
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 20, 2014 9:27:37 GMT
There is far more to it than just being 'super-sensitive' to certain things Mike, that is just one of the symptoms of the condition as a whole. Jo, myself and the family will have been together for five years in September and I began this journey with a few pre-conceived ideas on autism plus a complete denial of the existence of ADHD. Like many people I suspect I put the latter down to poor parenting. The last five years have truly opened my eyes and I know better now. You are correct about the complexity of autism though, no two sufferers experience quite the same symptoms.
|
|
|
|
Post by MikeMusic on Aug 20, 2014 16:39:10 GMT
Like so much there is more we don't know than we do know
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 8:19:26 GMT
In my experience there are a couple of things that make a big difference WRT speakers and the rest is fine tuning, but it greatly depends on the room.
For me, the amount of toe-in and the distance from the back wall seem to have the biggest effect (the latter is much more significant when the speakers have rear ports). The first reflection is probably next up. Luckily I don't have lots of hard surfaces in my listening room and the room doesn't have right angled corners so wall treatment isn't nearly as effective.
I've tried with and without grills and to be honest can't decide if it makes a difference.
|
|
