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Post by puffin on Nov 20, 2017 18:27:15 GMT
Am I right in thinking that you should treat the eqipment/speakers end of the room to deaden/diffuse it and leave the listening poisition more live?
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Post by Stratmangler on Nov 20, 2017 21:48:37 GMT
T'other way around.
The last thing you want is slapback reverb from around yer head....
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Post by liffy99 on Nov 20, 2017 23:13:39 GMT
But depends on speakers. Absorbing / diffusing some of the sound behind dipole speakers (I.e. planar types) can bring big benefits.
Quad took a tiny punt in this direction by placing material immediately behind the panels in their original ‘57 electrostatics.
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Post by MartinT on Nov 21, 2017 6:35:13 GMT
I would start without worrying about the speakers too much. Treat the corners first as they can be the worst. Put TubeTraps or other corner units in. The room should immediately start sounding less live.
Then think about front and rear reflections: a panel centre front between the speakers seems to help imaging. Similarly, one behind your head (or heavy drapes in my case) cleans up the sound.
Finally, work on side or other reflections, like the first side reflection from speaker to you on the side wall.
For bass boom, play something boomy and walk around the edge of the room listening to where it sounds boomiest. Put a bass trap there.
Don't forget about the floor if it's wooden or tiled. Nice heavy rug helps.
I find I far prefer absorption over diffusion. I've tried both and I prefer a room that's more dead.
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Post by puffin on Nov 21, 2017 10:29:26 GMT
Thanks for the replies. In the last week I thought I would have a play with some Rockwool batts that I suppose are doubling as diffusers/absorbers. I have put two spaced apart on each side wall to catch first reflections. The speakers are open baffle, but they have a damping panel on the rear already (manufacturer fitted) Doing the "clap test" it is surprising how much this has deadened the area, and to good effect. The soundstage and overall coherence has IMO improved. I thought about treating the ceiling above the speakers and have temporarily fitted a panel between the speakers, hanging about 9" below ceiling level. The jury is out on that one at the moment, and it might be that it is not in the best place. I do not really have a bass problem, so bass traps may not be required, unless of course it something you don't think you need until you try them. I've only spent about £30 so far and I feel it has been worthwhile. I don't suffer from "slap reverb" unless "her indoors" gives me a clout as this is my dedicated room and behind the seating position are "diffusers".....well lots of shelves with "resting equipment", and cables, CD rack etc...you get the scene.
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Post by zippy on Nov 21, 2017 11:28:16 GMT
I'd want to do before-and-after frequency tests to prove to myself that the difference was not imaginary !
...and as a matter of interest, are there any items of 'furniture' that would absorb bass around 50-100 Hz ?
It might be easier to sneak in something like a shelf full of books, for example, than an actual bass trap.
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Post by MartinT on Nov 21, 2017 11:49:12 GMT
I'd want to do before-and-after frequency tests to prove to myself that the difference was not imaginary ! If you can't hear a difference, you haven't done it right. Seriously, the difference between talking in normal voices in my empty music room before starting, and after everything had been setup, is startling. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2017 11:49:26 GMT
Room treatments really do work. I'm not saying other furnishing items can't work either, but in my current room, the treatments are of more importance than any of the equipment. It was simply so reflective it sounded like an echo chamber. I even struggled to hear dialogue on the TV due to the reverb. Room treatments have killed the lot and cost me under £70. Wherever I live in future, they will be in the forefront of my mind.
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Post by Clive on Nov 21, 2017 12:26:04 GMT
I'd want to do before-and-after frequency tests to prove to myself that the difference was not imaginary ! For bass you can usefully measure frequency but for other frequencies (bass too) you need to measure reverb / decay, frequencies may not change that much. |
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Post by zippy on Nov 21, 2017 12:28:00 GMT
Room treatments really do work. I'm not saying other furnishing items can't work either, but in my current room, the treatments are of more importance than any of the equipment. It was simply so reflective it sounded like an echo chamber. I even struggled to hear dialogue on the TV due to the reverb. Room treatments have killed the lot and cost me under £70. Wherever I live in future, they will be in the forefront of my mind. I don't doubt you for a minute, but your problem was reflections etc at higher frequencies. Those would seem to me quite easy to alleviate with carpets, rugs, sofas, curtains, etc. I don't think bass boom is as easy to fix without resorting to manufactured bass traps, and even then in a room that has to double as main sitting room they're a bit intrusive. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2017 12:56:15 GMT
Rugs, curtains and sofas made no difference. I'm not sure why you'd assume only HF reflections. It seemed to affect the whole spectrum.
i realise my current room isn't typical of a UK lounge but it's reminded me of how important the room is. Never again will I just plonk in a few soft furnishings and accept what I hear from a room. There's a reason why some rooms sound better than others and I'm now a believer in room treatments.
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Post by puffin on Nov 21, 2017 18:55:52 GMT
I changed the position of the ceiling panel and it has really made a difference. Well pleased.
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Post by Chris on Nov 21, 2017 20:04:08 GMT
I did a bit of all that recently and found a decent difference also. I used a rubber mat thing on the floor and added a couple of rugs. I also added a bit foam to the wall. All in all it was about £25 and well worth it.
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Post by MartinT on Nov 21, 2017 21:23:05 GMT
I don't think bass boom is as easy to fix without resorting to manufactured bass traps, and even then in a room that has to double as main sitting room they're a bit intrusive. For me the biggest fix for bass boom was using a different arrangement under the speakers: I switched from cone coupling to isolation (Lidl washing machine feet) on the tiled floor and it transformed the sound into much tighter bass with little sign of boom. |
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Post by zippy on Nov 23, 2017 14:26:05 GMT
I don't think bass boom is as easy to fix without resorting to manufactured bass traps, and even then in a room that has to double as main sitting room they're a bit intrusive. For me the biggest fix for bass boom was using a different arrangement under the speakers: I switched from cone coupling to isolation (Lidl washing machine feet) on the tiled floor and it transformed the sound into much tighter bass with little sign of boom. I already worked on that - in my room I found the bass is under better control by spiking the speakers though the carpet into the concrete floor. Still not right though ! |
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Post by MartinT on Nov 23, 2017 14:52:03 GMT
Perhaps a spiked platform through the carpet, with absorbent coupling to the speakers? Depends on the speakers or stands, of course.
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Post by The Brookmeister on Nov 23, 2017 23:25:30 GMT
I'd want to do before-and-after frequency tests to prove to myself that the difference was not imaginary ! If you can't hear a difference, you haven't done it right. Seriously, the difference between talking in normal voices in my empty music room before starting, and after everything had been setup, is startling. 100% in agreement, both at home and work its amazing what a few well placed panels do and a nice thick rug! |
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Post by ajski2fly on Feb 13, 2024 8:29:15 GMT
Been looking at Audiophile fuses and thinking do they really make a difference or is it just another product to get more money out of us poor hifi heads? Seems a lot of money for a nicely named fuse. What are your thoughts,has anybody tried or using them and do they actually make a difference in sound? Thanks Your simple question requires a qualified answer. Yes, fuses can have a very positive effect on sound quality... BUT, they find themselves at the bottom tier with more important things to attend to prior to their placement. I think of perfecting a good system in three tiers of implementation sequence: Tier One: Speakers, Amplifier, Player, DAC, Basic Power and Interface Cabling, Network Gear Tier Two: Power Supplies, DDC, Power Conditioning Tier Three: Fuses, Room Treatments, Contact Enhancer, Upgraded Interface Cabling If Tiers One and Two are properly attended to then the effects of Tier Three items can be much more impactful. I agree with the above, but would start looking at room treatment ASAP, even if it is just employing soft furnishings, wall hangings and plants in corners of the room. The impact that room reverb and bass reinforcement on how any system sounds is seriously underestimated and addressing early can result in some surprising results.  |
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Fro
Rank: Quartet
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Post by Fro on Feb 14, 2024 14:44:49 GMT
Speaking of room treatments, I have really been impressed with my Stillpoints Aperture II Acoustic panels. Used on the front and rear walls, they are extremely powerful combination diffraction/absorption characteristics.  |
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