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Post by MartinT on May 16, 2023 7:20:54 GMT
Well, sadly, after a very extended attempt to get them to crimp properly, I've had to abandon the Neutriks. The centre pin will not hold the solid silver core despite heaving with all my might on the crimper and the external crimp ring is too large, too.
I've put the Harmonic Technology cable in place temporarily and have another set of TruConnect BNC plugs on their way. I had no trouble with them on the Neotech cable last time so it'll be rebuilt soon enough.
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Post by MikeMusic on May 16, 2023 8:32:12 GMT
Most of my attempts at similar work result in no result
Lovely surprise when I am successful
Having the wrong tools or lacking the knowledge for me
If you failed at that there are few that would succeed
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Post by MartinT on May 16, 2023 9:02:35 GMT
Thing is, I tried very hard with the extremely poor information on the Neutrik site and have all the appropriate tools. Other BNCs work fine.
I am hardly a mass cable producer, but I do know how to strip and terminate cables. It's disappointing as those rear twist connectors look excellent.
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Post by MikeMusic on May 16, 2023 9:09:06 GMT
Doesn't help with poor info  Thought Neutrik would be top drawer |
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Post by MartinT on May 16, 2023 9:23:33 GMT
They have this bizarre idea of listing the connectors by compatible cable brand/model. So rather than have a selector matrix for core/braid/outer jacket sizes, you have to select each connector in turn (not in any size order) and look to see if the size is close to what you need. Absolutely pants for a premium connector vendor.
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Post by MikeMusic on May 16, 2023 9:54:33 GMT
Is this because they see themselves as *the* supplier ?
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Post by MartinT on May 19, 2023 6:32:44 GMT
I think, looking at the Neutrik's construction, the sizing is critical to the cable and I got one that is slightly too large in both the centre pin and crimp ring. However, Neotech is not mentioned for any plug and I'm not prepared to just randomly try again.
Good news, though, my TruConnect BNCs have arrived so I'm going to have some breakfast and get working on having the cable ready for operations again. It's been interesting listening to the HT cable in the meantime; it does everything well and is very listenable in itself. It slightly lacks the sparkle of the Neotech, is really the only difference.
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Post by MartinT on May 19, 2023 8:22:49 GMT
Magic - system is working again with the Neotech back in place. These two clock cables, HT and Neotech, are head and shoulders above any other clock cable I've tried. Amazing that a clock cable can make such a difference to the sound, but it really does.
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Post by MikeMusic on May 19, 2023 8:25:57 GMT
More proof that everything matters We should think about swapping socks over  |
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Post by MartinT on May 19, 2023 21:59:02 GMT
Up to date with the new Neotech clock cable in place.  |
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Post by MartinT on May 21, 2023 15:56:05 GMT
I've re-made the self-adhesive copper foil shielding of the four BNC plugs on my two clock cables: HT and Neotech. This time, I turned a small strip of the leading edge inside so as to make a positive connection with the BNC connector and not reply on the conductive properties of the adhesive alone. It's not pretty but I now know for sure that they completely surround and are in contact with the BNC casework.
I'll keep listening, just enjoying the music and see what transpires.
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Post by MartinT on May 24, 2023 7:46:21 GMT
I've been thinking through my setup, trying to spot any remaining potential performance bottlenecks. I've always wondered whether I made the right choice asking Tony to modify one of my Coherent 6D XLR pairs for XLR to phono, for the DAC to power amp run. Unfortunately, my Belles amp does not have XLR inputs. The Gustard DAC has perfectly good phono outputs but I had been stuck remembering that my previous LKS phono outputs sounded weak. However, I left it alone as the system sounds pretty good these days and I dislike tampering with it any more. Then Tony posted this in answer to a post by @ rodders and it triggered me into action. Why are you using XLR<> single ended converters? when use have singled end inputs anyway? By using those adapters you are just Pseudo Balanced ( just by connected pins 1 & 3 togther) even if you using these ground 0Vdc reference return sink pathway, you are then introducing the noise from the ground chassis not the 0Vdc into the mix not recommended for optimum noise floor reduction. I wondered whether my XLR to phono cable was possibly creating this noise and also stressing the Gustard's XLR -ve output by tying it permanently to ground. I set to trying the system with a phono to phono cable and having a listen. I cleaned up an old QED Qunex 1 phono cable (yes, old but decent) and treated it to some graphene contact treatment. I hooked it up, reminding myself that the Gustard phono outputs had never been used and might need some burn-in. After some listening I concluded the following: - The Qunex 1 cable isn't half bad! - No loss of volume, so using half XLR output is the same as phono in level terms - It sounds a little smoother, calmer and less stressed than the 6D XLR-phono - Soundstage is deeper - Bass potency is as good There is no way that the Qunex 1 should rival a Coherent 6D. It makes me think the XLR forced into single-ended is not performing optimally. I have left the system on Tara burn-in overnight, but I have already spoken to Tony about trying out a 6D phono cable for comparison. I think I've left some performance on the table and intend fixing it. |
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Post by MartinT on May 24, 2023 17:39:35 GMT
Further listening does reveal the Qunex 1's limitations, I was fairly certain it couldn't live in my system's company for much time. It's a bit shouty. However, the depth tells me what I've been missing and it's very good for a £20 cable. In any case, it proved the point so it did its job.
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Post by wannarock2 on May 24, 2023 21:10:47 GMT
yeah, if i had to guess, you are receiving close to the XLR ~5 volt
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Post by MartinT on May 25, 2023 5:04:55 GMT
yeah, if i had to guess, you are receiving close to the XLR ~5 volt No, the XLR to phono cable, just like adapters, ties the -ve pin to ground. Therefore it's getting 2.5V, which accounts for the volume being the same as the phono outputs. |
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Post by MartinT on May 27, 2023 17:02:37 GMT
It's been a lesson living with a somewhat compromised system for a few days. However, I'm still very much enjoying the music, which is a relief.
A recap: for a while now, I've not really been happy with a Coherent 6D cable that was an XLR to phono configuration. Completely my fault, as that's what I had asked Tony for. I had been caught up in the knowledge of my previous LKS DAC having a weak phono stage but a good XLR one. You can see where my thinking led me to. The Gustard is a completely different animal.
In using the XLR output this way, I have been using one side of the balanced output, the +ve, together with ground, into the phono connector, with the -ve output tied to ground. This is not ideal and, as Tony rightly pointed out in a response to another post, potentially introduces noise where it's not wanted. Additionally, the Gustard's balanced output is not being loaded symetrically, and adversely loading the -ve rail by tying it to ground. This has repercussions for the driver stage and the power supply rails.
The lesson in switching to the Qunex 1 has confirmed my suspicions: in many ways, using the phono output stage has improved soundstage depth and fine detail and made the presentation sound more comfortable. Conversely, the Qunex 1 being a copper cable of very basic quality, exhibits a somewhat shouty and uncouth nature in the vocal midrange band. In this respect, it is far from the quality of the Coherent 6D cable.
The good news is that Tony is sourcing me a phono-phono cable and, hopefully, I'll be up to full strength again soon.
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Post by John on May 27, 2023 17:14:46 GMT
We kind of all go through these temporary blocks with this passion I am sure the wait will be worth it
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Post by MartinT on May 27, 2023 17:41:23 GMT
Meanwhile, I've just found a virtually mint set of Yannis silver cables with WBT Ag phono connectors I didn't know I still had. These have gone in to replace the Qunex and they're certainly better. A bit light in the bass but better all round.
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Post by MartinT on May 29, 2023 10:39:09 GMT
Happily enjoying the Yannis silver interconnect cable, which needed a very large slab of Tara Labs burn-in making me wonder if I ever used them much. The 'silver sound' has calmed down a lot and the bass has filled in. I can cope with this. Superb on live albums, a touch bright on some studio albums.
Meanwhile, I'm looking forward to a trip to Tony's to pick up its replacement.
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Post by MartinT on May 30, 2023 13:24:51 GMT
For the record, I have now found my original purchase details and the cable I'm currently using is a Yannis Gaia 222Connect-Litz with WBT 0110Ag connectors. The cable is made from OCC silver cores and OFC copper braiding. I paid £365 for it back in 2015 and, now that I have fully burned it in, it really is an excellent preamp to power amp cable as originally specified. I only abandoned it rather quickly when I moved over to XLR.  Kudos to Yannis Tome for making some very fine cables. gaia.cabledesigns.co.uk/html/interconnect.html |
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📶NAS > Gustard x26p DAC > Benchmark LA4 Pre-Amp > NAD M22-V2 Amplifier > Revel F228Be Speakers