|
Post by dsjr on Jan 5, 2016 17:10:01 GMT
Why would you want to purchase something to cure a problem you might not have ? - cough - That's the reason why the NVA version is available to borrow; to see if one makes any difference to your setup at all - cough - If it makes no odds, nobody's lost anything apart from carriage charges to the next person...
By the way, the NVA has a 1000VA transformer inside, not the 500VA I thought it had. That puts the Airlink one a bit nearer in terms of price.
|
|
|
Post by pre65 on Jan 5, 2016 17:11:00 GMT
The DIY one I made had some transformer "buzz".
Resting the transformer on a layer of bubble wrap helped, but not something you could really do on a commercial design.
|
|
|
Post by John on Jan 5, 2016 17:13:21 GMT
The BMU when I had it plugged had no transformer noise The Balance mains unit I used to have would often have noise but a lot bigger transformer
|
|
|
Post by dsjr on Jan 5, 2016 17:55:51 GMT
The NVA transformer is well 'potted' in and the thick-walled case doesn't sing in sympathy either...
Speaking of cases, the Airlink one and others, use a simple bent metal case and the Doc feels this won't ultimately be as good (he tells me). Rather than me being a mouthpiece and in the way, the suggestion was made for someone to try to borrow an Airlink supply while they have the NVA BMU and compare them directly..
|
|
|
Post by ChrisB on Jan 5, 2016 19:01:15 GMT
I've heard several people talk of the Airlink transformers buzzing and, from looking at the build, I suspect the odd owner would get one where the case joins in the chorus. Others are available - mention has been made of the Russ Andrews ones, but there are more out there. Ben Duncan makes a few different models, for example.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2016 19:16:01 GMT
Have you seen what RA charges for a BMU?
|
|
|
Post by ChrisB on Jan 5, 2016 19:24:57 GMT
Yes. Ben Duncan's ones are pretty expensive too. I'm not recommending anything, just pointing out that there may be others that people don't know about. Additionally, some people may think people like Ben Duncan have some credibility as someone who know a bit about mains, whereas it's a commonly held belief that RA's pricing strategy is, shall we say, somewhat enthusiastic.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2016 21:22:24 GMT
I've heard several people talk of the Airlink transformers buzzing and, from looking at the build, I suspect the odd owner would get one where the case joins in the chorus. Others are available - mention has been made of the Russ Andrews ones, but there are more out there. Ben Duncan makes a few different models, for example. Hmmm - unfortunately £500 is already more than I would shell out so the other two are definitely out Also little point if what gains I might get could be overridden by any buzzes and rattles that might erupt from the cheaper alternatives ... guess this one goes to the back of the queue for the foreseeable.
|
|
|
Post by tony on Jan 7, 2016 19:14:16 GMT
I run an Airlink in my set up, it hums on switch on then goes quiet. As per my post I trusted my ears at what I heard during a bakeoff. A bit of advice regards what size of unit I needed from a trusted friend and it has remained in my system since.
I didnt think my mains were that bad....it improved what I had noticeably for fancy IC money.
It does duty on everything I plumb into the mains.
It cant turn shite into gold but will make the most of what you have for reasonable money.
|
|
|
Post by pinkie on Jan 7, 2016 21:35:33 GMT
You don't want to try one because you've already heard the (inconsequential) effect of one on someone else's system with a different mains supply? I'll tell you what. How's this for a deal? I have been corresponding with dsjr about carrying out a simple safety test, but he is reluctant because he is not confident with mains and accepts dunns assurance. The implication is he would be worried if my version was right, but feels I am wrong. I will go on the list and trial the nva bmu. I will report back my findings and get sue (who is really good) to do likewise. If it's any good I'll buy it. I will transfer £500 to Martin T before I buy it as a security deposit. However, on arrival, before auditioning, I will carry out a simple safety test. Following dsjr post that will be 2 simple safety tests. If it fails the tests, I won't proceed to the audition and nva pick up the postage cost, and Martin returns my funds. If it passes the safety test I'll buy it even if neither sue nor I hear any difference. I will video the safety tests, and post them. I could probably get Arthur to witness them. The safety test will be to take an inspection lamp with a 60w bulb and wire the blue wire to the earth pin. That is a fault condition with about a 1 amp load. It will trip the house rcds. I will then plug it into the bmu. If it trips the house rcd then Martin pays Dunn the £500.if it lights the lamp, Dunn pays the postage and the unit goes back. The 2nd test, just for dave, would be to wire brown to earth and leave blue on neutral (to test the need for a fuse on the neutral leg rated below 15amp). The light is still going to light when plugged in the bmu. I'll tell you what. Double or quits. If either safety test fails to light the light when plugged into the bmu and trips anything at all, I'll let Martin pay the £500. Deal or no Deal?
|
|
|
Post by John on Jan 7, 2016 21:40:04 GMT
This is not our unit we cannot comment if the manufacturer would want this or not and I do not see why they would have to submit to the test. Please in future conduct your deals with the manufacturer or DSJR
|
|
|
Post by Mr Whippy on Jan 7, 2016 21:51:56 GMT
Can I ask something?
What's so special about plugging an item of hi-fi into a BPS, that turns it into the spawn of Beelzebub, waiting, just waiting to trap the unwary audiophile?
What's the difference between plugging an amplifier into one and plugging say a mixing console into one, with regards safety? It's an everyday item in certain situations. Not exactly alien technology.
|
|
|
Post by pinkie on Jan 7, 2016 21:58:46 GMT
This is not our unit we cannot comment if the manufacturer would want this or not and I do not see why they would have to submit to the test. Please in future conduct your deals with the manufacturer or DSJR I was challenged by ChrisB to trial the unit in a forum post. I am accepting the challenge on the basis I can carry out a simple safety check for the benefit of my family and household insurance first. What's the problem?
|
|
|
Post by Greg on Jan 7, 2016 22:12:53 GMT
This is not our unit we cannot comment if the manufacturer would want this or not and I do not see why they would have to submit to the test. Please in future conduct your deals with the manufacturer or DSJR I was challenged by ChrisB to trial the unit in a forum post. I am accepting the challenge on the basis I can carry out a simple safety check for the benefit of my family and household insurance first. What's the problem? Absolutely none. Don't comment further, add yourself to the loan list and try it out, carrying out your safety tests first if that is your want (bearing in mind you will have no right to access the inside of the case). No need of ridiculous offers to lodge money with Martin or commit to a buy beforehand. Just trial it and report back afterwards, and please, please, please, bloody well stay silent until you have done it. Simples.
|
|
|
Post by Slinger on Jan 7, 2016 22:19:30 GMT
You don't want to try one because you've already heard the (inconsequential) effect of one on someone else's system with a different mains supply? I'll tell you what. How's this for a deal? I have been corresponding with dsjr about carrying out a simple safety test, but he is reluctant because he is not confident with mains and accepts dunns assurance. The implication is he would be worried if my version was right, but feels I am wrong. I will go on the list and trial the nva bmu. I will report back my findings and get sue (who is really good) to do likewise. If it's any good I'll buy it. I will transfer £500 to Martin T before I buy it as a security deposit. However, on arrival, before auditioning, I will carry out a simple safety test. Following dsjr post that will be 2 simple safety tests. If it fails the tests, I won't proceed to the audition and nva pick up the postage cost, and Martin returns my funds. If it passes the safety test I'll buy it even if neither sue nor I hear any difference. I will video the safety tests, and post them. I could probably get Arthur to witness them. The safety test will be to take an inspection lamp with a 60w bulb and wire the blue wire to the earth pin. That is a fault condition with about a 1 amp load. It will trip the house rcds. I will then plug it into the bmu. If it trips the house rcd then Martin pays Dunn the £500.if it lights the lamp, Dunn pays the postage and the unit goes back. The 2nd test, just for dave, would be to wire brown to earth and leave blue on neutral (to test the need for a fuse on the neutral leg rated below 15amp). The light is still going to light when plugged in the bmu. I'll tell you what. Double or quits. If either safety test fails to light the light when plugged into the bmu and trips anything at all, I'll let Martin pay the £500. Deal or no Deal? pinkie, please re-read your post and try to see how rude you are sounding. You keep talking about "dunn" rather than NVA, the company that makes the BMU in question whilst you keep telling us there's no personal agenda here. Personally, if you spoke to, or about, me in that tone then I wouldn't give you the time of day, let alone a BMU to play with. I apologise to the admins/mods if this comes across as ad hominem and I'm quite happy to "take one for the team" by saying what other people must surely be thinking about this whole dead-horse-flogging debacle. Speak to NVA pinky, see if you can get on the list to borrow a BMU to trial, and see if it improves your sound system, not lights your lamp. Please do it quietly and privately though.
|
|
|
Post by ChrisB on Jan 7, 2016 22:20:34 GMT
Hardly a challenge Richard. The problem is that you are once again using TAS to continue your feud. We have repeatedly told you that it is not acceptable and you've repeatedly continued.
For one last time we will tell you to take your argument to your opponent. This really is the last time.
|
|
|
Post by dsjr on Jan 7, 2016 22:46:40 GMT
It's not that I'm not confident with mains - I used to delve inside CRT TV's with far higher voltages flying around - but I really don't want to be pig in the middle here - I had enough of that with two opposing individuals late last year.
I have a little system with all sorts connected through the BMU. I like what it does - for me it's subtle but important - and bought it. I'm confident in our mains supply and how our trips work, so feel utterly confident in how the BMU works here at home. I don't want to risk damage to anything just to prove a third party's point, sorry!
As for Pinkie trying one after all the recent history, I don't know and it's not my call on this one. I suggested repeatedly that he leaves the whole balanced mains thing alone and looks to buy and report on a Benchmark amp (put his money where his attitude is) as his old pal had a hand in its development and he was plugging it like mad when it first appeared...
|
|
|
Post by pinkie on Jan 8, 2016 6:10:18 GMT
Hardly a challenge Richard. The problem is that you are once again using TAS to continue your feud. We have repeatedly told you that it is not acceptable and you've repeatedly continued. For one last time we will tell you to take your argument to your opponent. This really is the last time. I thought this forum was running a loan scheme. I thought it was suggested I should try the product and report back. I thought there was an implication that I was blinkered for being unprepared to try the product. So I agreed to try it. MOD: no, we are not running a loan scheme! Are you incapable of understanding what has been written? We are allowing NVA (as well as any other vendor) to run a loan scheme for the benefit of our members. We suggested you try the BMU - that is between you and the vendor to organise. If you want to test it, you need the vendor's permission.
|
|
|
Post by John on Jan 8, 2016 6:14:47 GMT
You want to try it with a whole bunch of conditions which we cannot have no part of
Now you know where you stand no more please Pinky this really is tedious
|
|
|
Post by dsjr on Jan 8, 2016 9:44:40 GMT
I hope we are all adults here (although we can all have childish tantrums and flounces on occasion). ANY product that plugs into the mains will carry a risk of some sort - hairdryers (although I'm long past needing one sadly), toasters (partly exposed heating resistor elements through the slots), electric saws and even metal bodied kettles (I've had shocks from these in the past - I'm talking 60's UK made Russell Hobbs, not a cheap Chinese import as they all are now). Where audio is concerned, valve amps carry HUGE risks as the voltages are so high and CRT TV's and monitors too. There's that awful avatar someone uses with a little boy supposedly inserting a metal bodied knife into a US mains outlet - sorry, as a father, that scares me to death...
All I'm suggesting is some common sense here please. I've never known a product mains transformer go short or partly short internally without a lot of noise, heat and a foul smell. Failing open just stops the unit from working, period. The kind of gear these days features well insulated and booted internal mains connections, or should do. I maintain that a BMU used properly and sensibly has no issues and its the responsibility of the user to ensure that equipment connected to it is well maintained and not carelessly cobbled together (kit amps, especially valve ones, although some Chinese built models look awful in comparison to many beautifully made home built amps I've seen..).
How 'Nanny' should a nanny state be?
|
|