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Post by ChrisB on Dec 28, 2015 13:19:30 GMT
As it seems that Mike has upset RD by being a little slow with the loan BMU, I'd like to clarify who is on the list to borrow it in order to obviate any possibility for further upset or confusion there may be over this.
As far as I am aware, John is next in line and Mike will be sending it to him. After that I was expecting to try it out but I will give it a miss if there is still any bad feeling or if someone else was expecting to have received it by now or next week. I certainly don't want to be the cause of any problems to anyone else and will go without trying it rather than see any more upset.
I know that Steve (Accudazed) would like to try it too and he was hoping to take it after me as he said in the BMU thread.
It would really help if Kaz would get a proper grip on the organisation of this because Martin is currently acting as middle man, which I don't think is really fair. Additionally, it has not gone unnoticed with me that the part of the bargain where Kaz contributes to this forum as a normal member has not really been fulfilled as expected. Here's hoping that will change sometime soon.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2015 16:13:38 GMT
There is no bad feeling but if someone wants to try something they should have the courtesy to do just that within a reasonable time period so that others on the loan list can have it. Everyone is welcome as long as they don't sit on it for weeks and have little interest in giving it a proper trial. I think this is just polite and considerate behaviour expected with any loan product.
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Post by dsjr on Dec 28, 2015 16:35:19 GMT
I appreciate that many people, including myself on occasion, can suffer VERY painful back trouble that takes ages to abate, but if that's the case and the BMU or similar ends up not being used for a while because it cannot be man-handled into position, then PLEASE let the forum know, so it can be passed on to someone else, returning to the injured party when the back trouble has eased enough to unpack and use it. Collecting carriers can supply paperwork to stick on the box as long as it's intact with no sign of coming apart and friendly drivers can help with tape and lifting too, or at least ours do..
I'm not being judgemental here honestly, but the ultimate aim of these loans is to hopefully get sales out of it and get the products discussed by people who have actually used them. No obligation as these products are to be passed around, but hopefully you get my drift.
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Post by ChrisB on Dec 28, 2015 16:52:39 GMT
I completely agree that the unit should have been moved on within the allotted time or contact made to ask for it to be extended. However, it looks to me as though there is bad feeling from RD and I have once again been insulted by him on his forum - that may or may not be related to this, I don't know but I am now going to bow out from the offer of a loan of the BMU.
So, Richard, thank you for the offer but I will make other arrangements.
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Post by dsjr on Dec 28, 2015 19:13:12 GMT
I don't think that's quite the case Chris. Far be it for me to be thought of as a 'Doc A*se Licker,' (although some will see it that way now ) I confirm that he talks face-to-face as directly as he types, only 'face to face' it's easier to read the body language behind the words and if I have it coming my way, which has happened, I can be a crabby old git back as well when called on to be I honestly don't think any brickbats were hurled your way, only irritation that the BMU has effectively been out of circulation for a couple of weeks when someone else could have used it to sate their own curiosity. Kaz and I are here to hopefully help smooth the waters a little and DEFINITELY NOT stir up any more rubbish I promise. All of us can be our own worst enemies at times, but the best of us will hopefully apologise if we've ever caused upset.
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Post by ChrisB on Dec 28, 2015 19:47:27 GMT
Dave, I appreciate that you, like me are someone who prefers to get on with life without conflict but to be called an arse-licker (reformed or otherwise) on a publicly accessible web site is an insult whichever way I look at it.
I was not a moderator at AoS because of some sycophantic desire to be Marco's lackie and yes-man. I did it because I wanted to be more involved in what, was for a while, the best of the bigger non-commercial UK hifi forums. As you well know, a forum is not its owner, but rather it is its membership and that was what I was there to serve.
I have never once insulted RD and, despite having received several years of abuse from him and some of his mates because of my association with Marco, we allowed them all to join TAS. In doing that, I believe we went above and beyond what most people would expect of us and we were derided by many for doing it. However, we went ahead and did it in order to try to be fair. Now, we stretch our rules to the limit to demonstrate that we can distinguish between the man and his company and still we are insulted by being labelled as having been arse-lickers.
Arse-licker! I bloody well resigned as a moderator at AoS because I fell out with Marco by trying to make him be reasonable towards Mr. Richard Dunn!
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Post by dsjr on Dec 28, 2015 20:29:27 GMT
Ooooops, apologies... Thing is, from a distance, it can look that Marco had you all in his pocket, in the same way that I was told by certain people that I'd be almost certainly not welcomed if I attended audio 'do's' up north because of my NVA association. I've lost count of the emails I have received criticising the Doc over and over again and in no uncertain terms. I am also vaguely aware that the room out-back wasn't always as smooth running as the main site appeared to be in past years...
I assure you that no insult was intended and he has apologised on his site. Having said that, I agree though, that there is a certain 'shadow' that tries to loom in the background where certain people are concerned, but I don't need to tell you to let it dissipate so it has no influence.
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Post by John on Dec 28, 2015 20:57:41 GMT
I think there is often a presumption to what goes on behind the scenes on forums. which is often far removed from the truth. I still want to have the opportunity to listen to the BMU and should get the unit over the next few days and will report back as quick as I can and then pass it on. Dave it is great that you are posting and putting forward a balance view point. Kaz has really been lacking in his presence on TAS
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Post by MartinT on Dec 28, 2015 22:35:13 GMT
Some facts for the digestion of all:
1) I resigned as a moderator and left AoS because I disagreed with the owner on the direction AoS was taking and how it was run. I did not leave AoS to form TAS. I have no further connection with the forum or the individual. As a parting gift, many of my 17,000 posts were deleted. I sure as shit do not 'arse-lick' them or anyone else.
2) Chris, John and I formed TAS for the love of hi-fi and music. We make not a penny from it and never will. We maintain impartiality so that opinions are just that, not adverts.
3) I approached Chris and John with the proposal that we encourage the discussion of NVA products and the loan scheme because we wanted openness and fairness to all products and manufacturers and we could see that it was not happening. We respect our membership far too much to stifle such discussions.
Like Chris, I am furious at being called an arse-licker. However, I will let it pass. I still believe in fair representation of all products and opinions here at TAS. I will not throw any mud back.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2015 0:30:53 GMT
I'm glad you guys have come out and clarified the situation as it was never clear to most and certainly to RD MOD: sorry, we can't have any more naming here*. Hope that everyone can put past insults behind them and it appears RD has appologised. Just hope this experiment with the NVA loans can continue smoothly.
*Chris and I were responding to a direct slur and accusation, which needed correcting, not bringing new baggage into the conversation. We must now leave this be and not have any more naming of external people. Thanks.
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Post by ChrisB on Dec 29, 2015 0:46:25 GMT
The thing is that we have never wanted to sling mud in any direction - it is not something that any of us are naturally inclined to do. Equally, we have never felt it necessary to justify our actions to anyone - why should we? I was extremely reluctant to reveal the facts which I did. It's great that apologies have been offered but the thing is that making judgments of people based on assumptions can be extremely damaging.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2015 1:51:01 GMT
I have followed this thread with some interest - initially with a view to learning more about the BMU and other NVA gear (of which I have zilch knowledge or experience) To be honest, any interest I may have had has rapidly evaporated if there's so much baggage attached. All I can gather from this is some poor bloke being lambasted for not trying the unit out within a few days of receiving it - at Christmas and when half the country is threatened with the risk of having their house and home washed out overnight ... all apparently down to some arcane inter forum disputes from yonks ago. Does anyone wishing to take part in this loan scheme really have to take account of all this BS ?
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Post by ChrisB on Dec 29, 2015 2:00:04 GMT
No you shouldn't have to take it into account and I apologise that the thread developed in this way. We will probably split the off topic stuff out of the thread.
If you are interested in the BMU, then you really should take the opportunity to try it.
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Post by DaveC on Dec 29, 2015 8:45:26 GMT
As a parting gift, many of my 17,000 posts were deleted. . Who deleted 17,00 posts ? And ChrisB did you stand up for me too ? Recent event have shown that I was right all along.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2015 9:45:12 GMT
This is drifting way off topic now. It's a shame as a well coordinated loan scheme is a superb way to get product to prospective purchasers.
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Post by ChrisB on Dec 29, 2015 9:53:15 GMT
Indeed. And as Martin stated last night, we don't want any more baggage brought into this thread.
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Post by DaveC on Dec 29, 2015 9:54:27 GMT
So that's a no then, thought so !
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Post by MartinT on Dec 29, 2015 10:11:35 GMT
Who deleted 17,00 posts ? Dave, it's obvious, and it was 17,000 or so posts I had reached in AoS. I didn't say 'all', I said 'many'. Take a look, my status is 'guest' which is special consideration since no-one else has this status on AoS as far as I can see. Their loss!
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Post by MartinT on Dec 29, 2015 10:28:50 GMT
This is drifting way off topic now. It's a shame as a well coordinated loan scheme is a superb way to get product to prospective purchasers. We will do some separating off of non-topic material so that this loan thread is restored.
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Post by DaveC on Dec 29, 2015 10:29:21 GMT
OK, I half thought it might have been you ? But I completely understand now, another nail.
I would post here more often, but I would continually fall foul of the trade rules as it's impossible to separate the two.
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