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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 6:47:04 GMT
This thread has been responsible for me loosing all interest in this forum, and feeling I have no common ground with this form of hifi tinkering. I started this thread and have been very careful to keep my findings honest. You can take it or leave it as you wish, there is no forum mantra here and you are not compelled to read it or agree with it.
However, what is daft is for one thread to make you 'loose all interest in this forum'. It's lose, by the way. |
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 6:51:05 GMT
He reckons putting all your kit through only one fuse actually makes it worse. Many systems have a single fuse feeding a distribution block or regenerator. This is the most critical fuse in the chain and the one that brings the most benefit if you change it. It's obvious, really, all the current draw goes through it so if there is any thermal non-linearity then all the components are affected. |
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 6:54:51 GMT
What I find inequitable is one can keep saying how wonderful fuses are in ones system but it is frowned upon to mention more than once that fuses have made no difference. It's perfectly fine and congratulations for trying it for yourself. Now you have an opinion! It's a forum, there are bound to be heated discussions like this but as long as we don't descend into name calling then we're doing ok. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 8:17:58 GMT
He reckons putting all your kit through only one fuse actually makes it worse. Many systems have a single fuse feeding a distribution block or regenerator. This is the most critical fuse in the chain and the one that brings the most benefit if you change it. It's obvious, really, all the current draw goes through it so if there is any thermal non-linearity then all the components are affected. Your explanation makes perfect sense, Martin. I think the issue lay in Mr Tibbs sweeping statement about the Hydra. It only really applies when Hydra is compared to separate sockets for each component. Then we are comparing a single fuse for all components against a separate fuse for each. when a multi block is added to the equation, we are then in a different scenario and I struggle to see how a Hydra can be worse. We are now comparing one fuse for all components against a combination of an individual fuse for each AND a single shared fuse. Logic would surely dictate that this cannot be better than a Hydra in terms of fuses because we still have the shared one,plus another one in each circuit. I'm assuming a fuse cannot improve the sound here. Your post has has actually highlighted an easy test I can try. I have one of those gold plated fuse blanks. I will try it in my multi block plug. As each component is individually fused, it is not necessary to have this extra fuse. I will try this at the weekend and report back. I actually have two identical mains blocks, so comparison is relatively easy and quick |
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Post by ChrisB on Feb 12, 2015 8:32:13 GMT
This also exposes the danger of taking one single example of a test as an absolute for all - there are any number of things that can influence the outcome of a test.
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Post by danielquinn on Feb 12, 2015 10:14:34 GMT
If I hit martin over the head with a gun and moore cricket bat and then offer to repeat my the test on you with a gray nichols cricket bat you would decline because you would be as sure as you possibly can be that the outcome would be the same .
what is it about hifi fuses that does not negate the necessity for individual suck it and see ?
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 11:28:47 GMT
what is it about hifi fuses that does not negate the necessity for individual suck it and see ? Translating that into normalised English, what's wrong with individual opinions? Hi-Fi and music are subjective pursuits.
The rest of your post is drivel!
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Post by danielquinn on Feb 12, 2015 11:41:22 GMT
what is it about hifi fuses that does not negate the necessity for individual suck it and see ? Translating that into normalised English, what's wrong with individual opinions? Hi-Fi and music are subjective pursuits.
The rest of your post is drivel!
It would help if you denounced my post with logic not rhetoric . it is not drivel , it concerns the status we are to give to your opinions and the reasons as to why i would believe you about being hit on the head with a cricket bat but consider your comments on fuses to be stretching my credulity . There is nothing wrong with individual opinions, but a world in which individual opinions are just accepted and placed upon an equal plateau of validity is a world that does not progress and is confused and chaotic . Hifi is a subjective and solipsistic pursuit and I am more than happy to accept that your posts on the effects of these fuses in your system to your ears is honest , genuine and valid . What concerns me is your desire to place the effects of these fuses outside of yourself and suggestions that they have an objective external reality outside of Martin T and that anybody who happened to find themselves in your listening room could also hear what you report and accordingly it may be worthwhile them also purchasing them . |
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 11:55:07 GMT
I make claims only as to what I hear. However, not to report on it would pretty well negate the entire reason for this forum's existence. If we cannot discuss findings and what may lie behind them, we would end up as an objectivist place, which would be about as interesting as reading The Silmarillion.
It's not for nothing that I said "Hi-Fi and music are subjective pursuits" and I say that as an engineer. Fuses are not nearly as subjective and irrational as cables since thermal non-linearity in fuses is a well understood and measurable phenomenon and forms part of how they work.
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Post by danielquinn on Feb 12, 2015 12:06:26 GMT
Your post is an example of why pedants like me seek to challenge things that we find difficult to believe have objective foundations .
You begin by accepting the subjectivity of your position, but because you do not wish to accept that what you hear is perhaps "all in your mind" for want of better description, you seek to explain it and thereby objectify it .
How does thermal none linearity effect sound quality ?
And cables are in the signal path. You must be the only person i have read who considers fuses less controversial than cables .
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 13:20:09 GMT
You must be the only person i have read who considers fuses less controversial than cables . It's obvious to me! |
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Post by danielquinn on Feb 12, 2015 15:52:21 GMT
Those evil giants were obvious for Don Quixote  |
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Post by pinkie on Feb 12, 2015 16:10:24 GMT
Yes - I knew, but couldn't be arsed to edit. What's good enough for Roger Waters on his Animals album cover is good enough for me. And you're right on the other point. I think Sue turning 50 tomorrow has re-awoken my angst of 4 years ago. I am going to console myself by treating myself to that acoustic guitar I crave. The vendor's motto neatly sums up my feelings about turning 50 "Lifes too short to play a shitty guitar" (Not that my current acoustic is shitty - its just not as special as the Messiah) And life's too short to worry what people hear when they fiddle with bits of their HiFi that make less difference than the paint on the walls. As I pointed out to Chris, in a message, never mind buggering about with fuses (I also tried that since MCRU sent me some) - last Christmas I removed the National Grid and replaced it with a 3KVA generator lent by my ex-wife, whilst we had a power cut, and that made sod-all difference. But I like this forum, and the people on it, and wouldn't wish to cause offence. I will knuckle down to a few bar chords instead |
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Post by MartinT on Feb 12, 2015 16:12:41 GMT
You think you have problems? I'm now closer to 60 than 50, which is utterly scary!  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 17:44:15 GMT
You think you have problems? I'm now closer to 60 than 50, which is utterly scary! Babe in arms  |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Feb 12, 2015 18:28:58 GMT
You think you have problems? I'm now closer to 60 than 50, which is utterly scary! Babe in arms You old git! |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 19:25:15 GMT
Babe in arms You old git! Dats me folks  |
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Post by yomanze on Feb 13, 2015 14:39:46 GMT
I certainly advocate Deoxit spray for cleaning all contacts, including fuseholders. DeOxit is completely non-conductive though, so should be thoroughly removed after treatment. It's why Naim recommend cycles of plugging and unplugging to remove films and residues from "treated" plugs. |
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Post by MartinT on Feb 13, 2015 15:32:26 GMT
Yes, I'd agree with that. I automatically fit/refit plugs and fuses these days to clean the contact areas. The spray is not supposed to be an intermediary between the surfaces.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2015 17:00:52 GMT
DQ and the Spanish inquisition PII
Not so long ago in the depths of the late sound ages, across the vast ocean of mediocre reproduction and preen sally audio.
Once again DQ rides into the thick of battle waving his standard of truth, justice and the DQ way.
Take heed fellow combatants the master of incisive inquisitorial prowess is poised and ready to strike, waiting with cool, calculated intuition.
DQ the master of ceremonies most aqueous and debatable will take on those evil beings of audio recommendations seen as 'pure preen sally tosh' as manifestations so unearthly that the sign of the southern cross will only suffice to banish such unthinkable utterings to the realms of intransigence spirit highways.
DQ we salute your tower of iron will that will triumph over the ego whips of audio serpent lubricant
All Hail DQ the champion of the audio challenged
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