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Post by MartinT on Jul 20, 2020 18:33:28 GMT
I really object to a non-amplifying device being called a preamp or an amp. Passive preamp is an oxymoron.
They are volume controls.
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Post by bigman80 on Jul 20, 2020 18:35:55 GMT
I really object to a non-amplifying device being called a preamp or an amp. Passive preamp is an oxymoron. They are volume controls. "Preamplifier" literally means "before the amplifier" doesn't it? Or if active, it would be pre-amplifier, amplification device 🤔 The volume control is the Pot or stepped attenuator? That was how I understood it anyway. Now you've got me thinking 😆 |
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Post by user211 on Jul 20, 2020 18:38:12 GMT
Go and ferret and you'll be able to answer your own question. As said, a number of Alps pots use/used conductive plastic. And just because one goes noisey, it hardly equates to it not being conductive plastic. Of course it could have been a fake and who's to say what the construction might have been - without disassembling it. Didn't find much on it in 5 minutes but it is apparent that conductive polymers exist that do indeed conduct without metallisation. The Alps Blue just went out like any ordinary pot. The wiper went noisy, you could alleviate it a bit by repeated back and forth motion. Just like a cheap metal pot. I ordered another one to replace it. It was exactly the same externally. It was in a Beard amp originally. The Penny & Giles pots were expensive but they exuded quality Alps Blue don't posses. Alps do make some very high quality pots. I own one and it is fairly insane. |
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Post by julesd68 on Jul 20, 2020 18:38:36 GMT
Ah yes, I remember when these amps first surfaced they did cause a few 'audiophile arguments' ... 2x The Truth preamps...one early edition, one late edition and two LDR stereo Coffee ones. Both professionally built. They were all massively bass heavy in my system. Veiled too. The Truth preamps were worse than the stereo coffee but the construction quality of both Stereo coffee were really poor. Most interesting. Some people equate 'The Truth' to the Second Coming which is why I would have been intrigued to hear one in my system. It makes me wonder whether there was some kind of common denominator in systems where it has excelled. |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 20, 2020 18:41:59 GMT
Metallised?
What metal is used in a potentiometer track?
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 20, 2020 18:45:46 GMT
Stand corrected.  |
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Post by bigman80 on Jul 20, 2020 18:45:59 GMT
2x The Truth preamps...one early edition, one late edition and two LDR stereo Coffee ones. Both professionally built. They were all massively bass heavy in my system. Veiled too. The Truth preamps were worse than the stereo coffee but the construction quality of both Stereo coffee were really poor. Most interesting. Some people equate 'The Truth' to the Second Coming which is why I would have been intrigued to hear one in my system. It makes me wonder whether there was some kind of common denominator in systems where it has excelled. The guy who brought them round was absolutely stunned at what we heard. It was a really obvious thickening of the LF with quite a degree of detail loss. HF sounded rolled off too. We attributed it to the unit, thinking it must be faulty but when we plugged the new one in, it was exactly the same. Now, I am not giving a blanket statement on all LDR pres, just talking of the 4 specifix units I had through here. The Stereo Coffee ones were far better, but everything was etched and grainy, compared to the silky Dave Slage Autoformers. That Dave Slagle preamp was simply superb...just sounded a touch warm and it annoyed me. |
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Post by jandl100 on Jul 20, 2020 18:53:32 GMT
I really object to a non-amplifying device being called a preamp or an amp. Passive preamp is an oxymoron. They are volume controls. The way I see it, amplification is like acceleration, it can be positive or negative. Things can go faster/louder or slower/quieter. Both are valid types of acceleration or amplification. |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 20, 2020 18:54:12 GMT
Mention of LDR types, has me remembering a dynamic range enhancer I once built using them yonks ago.
I was always aware of it pumping, if you know what I mean.
It was interesting idea though.
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Post by bigman80 on Jul 20, 2020 18:55:01 GMT
Mention of LDR types, has me remembering a dynamic range enhancer I once built using them yonks ago. I was always aware of it pumping, if you know what I mean. It was interesting idea though. Oooooo, now thats something that modern day music would really benefit from! |
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Post by bigman80 on Jul 20, 2020 18:55:48 GMT
If my memory serves me right John brought a Dave Slagle pre round to my place last year ... Is that JohnG? Big fella....Real nice guy? He has a couple I think |
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Post by julesd68 on Jul 20, 2020 18:56:30 GMT
Most interesting. Some people equate 'The Truth' to the Second Coming which is why I would have been intrigued to hear one in my system. It makes me wonder whether there was some kind of common denominator in systems where it has excelled. That Dave Slagle preamp was simply superb...just sounded a touch warm and it annoyed me. If my memory serves me right John brought a Dave Slagle pre round to my place last year or earlier when I was getting my streaming set up ... |
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Post by julesd68 on Jul 20, 2020 18:57:26 GMT
No, it's John from here - not a very nice guy at all ...   |
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Post by bigman80 on Jul 20, 2020 18:58:54 GMT
No, it's John from here - not a very nice guy at all ... Hahahaha...avoid him then lol |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 20, 2020 19:04:33 GMT
Mention of LDR types, has me remembering a dynamic range enhancer I once built using them yonks ago. I was always aware of it pumping, if you know what I mean. It was interesting idea though. Oooooo, now thats something that modern day music would really benefit from! A modern digital effort might sound ok. But what I built you could hear it sort of sucking and blowing. Another failure. I had more failures than anything I was happy with. |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 20, 2020 19:14:38 GMT
I really object to a non-amplifying device being called a preamp or an amp. Passive preamp is an oxymoron. They are volume controls. A preamp does suggest an active stage. I doubt the term "passive preamp" exists outside the audiophile sector. |
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Post by Clive on Jul 20, 2020 19:25:09 GMT
I try to use "passive pre" but then someone will ask, pre to what?
I think the ALPS Blue can work very well but it needs to be in a proper active preamp with a buffer before it and buffer or gain stage after it. As a passive pre I find it a little muddy.
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Post by MartinT on Jul 20, 2020 19:52:52 GMT
Preamp just means the pre-amplifier, the stage before the power amplifier. The opposite of amplifier is attenuator. An amplifier never attenuates. I rest my case  |
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Post by Mr Whippy on Jul 21, 2020 5:30:42 GMT
And traditionally, what preceded the power amplifier? Volume control (sometimes a buffer), tone controls, switching, and a phono equaliser, not needed with ceramic cartridges.
The advent of cd popularised the idea of two pots in a box.
It did exist before then though. I think PS Audio pioneered (or was one) the idea of having a stand alone switching unit with volume control, along with a separate phono stage and power amplifier. They have a different approach to signal attenuation now. It's done now by manipulating the power amp's sensitivity.
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Post by user211 on Jul 21, 2020 7:13:27 GMT
Stand corrected. Are you attempting to correct me here? Just wondering. Because I was well aware of that. What I am saying is it is bollocks, basically. |
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