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Post by Dave on Jul 11, 2014 22:45:42 GMT
I have an old Advent netbook which is currently with a friend who is putting Linux on it for me. It was originally supplied with WinXP installed but now MS has stopped supporting XP I figured it would be much too risky, from a security POV, to keep it on there, plus, of course, Linux is available for nowt. The processor is a single core, dual threaded 1.6ghz Intel Atom and I stuck an extra GB of DDR2 533 memory in it shortly after I purchased it.
My question is, would it be up to the task of operating as a dedicated music server? I won't be needing it for anything else so the plan is to install only the software it will need to perform this task. If this is a feasible proposition then I intend to run it solely on battery power when listening to music, which will prevent any nasties coming down the pipe via the charger.
I'd welcome any advice which might be useful please... TA!!!
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Post by Pinch on Jul 12, 2014 12:04:44 GMT
Hi Dave, Spec-wise, the machine sounds like it will be able to cope - as in, it should have enough power to stream to your DAC. There seems to be relatively little info out there on how best to use a Linux based platform for this purpose, but at least some of the more well known players are (slowly) being ported to Linux, and there are of course other options (some outlined here). An issue with running from the battery is that the OS may be configured to apply various power saving measures when unplugged from the mains (some info here under 'battery'), and these can introduce problems of their own, but presumably you'll be able to reconfigure things to prevent this.
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Post by Pinch on Jul 12, 2014 12:11:33 GMT
Oh, also, I take your point about MS ceasing to support XP, but if you're using the machine as a dedicate music server, then presumably you'll not be connected to the net, and this will obviously diminish the potential exposure to risks.
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Post by Dave on Jul 12, 2014 12:17:40 GMT
Thanks Pinch :
Regarding power saving, Advent configured XP quite heavily to achieve extended battery life, however my friend is aware of what I intend to use it for so he will not be implementing any of Linux's power saving features. When the machine is fully set up for audio playback I will experiment with the settings to see what I can get away with using. With me not being all that familiar with Linux though this set up procedure could be a long and rocky road. I have tried to get to grips with Linux on a couple of occasions before which may explain why I no longer have any hair... lol
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Post by Dave on Jul 12, 2014 12:21:24 GMT
Oh, also, I take your point about MS ceasing to support XP, but if you're using the machine as a dedicate music server, then presumably you'll not be connected to the net, and this will obviously diminish the potential exposure to risks. Ah that's the thing you see, I'm a bit of a Spotify addict...
EDIT: I have just noticed that I've posted this in the wrong section, it should be in 'Sources'. Could a mod kindly relocate it whenever it is convenient... Thank you
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shane
Rank: Duo
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Post by shane on Jul 12, 2014 13:34:56 GMT
I recently re-configured an EEEPC901 to run Linux. Had lots of problems finding a suitable distro but finally settled on Lubuntu ( lubuntu.net/ ), which it runs brilliantly. I only use it for web browsing but I'm sure it would be able to support something like LMS as well. It's certainly happy enough running i_player and streaming fron Deezer. Battery life is about 3-4 hours.
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Post by Dave on Jul 12, 2014 13:55:25 GMT
That's interesting, thanks for that Shane. Yup, getting three to four hours out of mine too, not bad considering it must be at least seven years old now. Netbooks may not be all that speedy but I can honestly say it has been the most reliable and dependable computer I have ever owned. With XP installed and 2gb of memory onboard it fairly flies along, as long as one doesn't expect miracles of it, for example, running AutoCAD might challenge its capabilities somewhat... Another thing, it would boot up into XP in around 15 to 20 seconds which is pretty impressive for such a lowly specced machine.
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Post by AlanS on Jul 12, 2014 14:21:16 GMT
Why do people try to make ancient computers of cost cutting spec with limited lifespan and at greater risk of failure the new centre of their music ? Do you buy worn out styluses or knackered CD Players.
This week at work a server that is used to delivery a mapping system to the whole organisation failed. When will it be working was the question all day? The disk controller just gave up. Fortunately we found a retired same model and cannibalised the controller from that to get it running then copied everything on the broken server to a NEWer machine and another newer machine for safety and resilience.
If you are happy to loose all you music then save pennies, otherwise get smart.
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Post by Dave on Jul 12, 2014 14:43:04 GMT
A fair point Alan so let me clarify why I'm confident about using it for its intended purpose: 1: It was purchased as a back-up machine in case my main lappy went west so has seen minimal use (In fact it has out-lived two laptops since I bought it). 2: It will be playing files stored on two, two terabyte WD external hard drives which hold all my media files and their back-ups. 3: The only software to be installed on the machine will be that which it needs to play those files. 4: I don't believe in chucking perfectly serviceable equipment in the bin if it is still of use and working to spec. And finally... 5: Last December the netbooks hard drive failed, However because I had the foresight to take out an extended warranty, which I renewed a couple of years ago, the servicing company installed a new one for me and also replaced the screen as it had a patch of dead pixels down in the bottom, lefthand corner. I think that just about covers it...
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Post by AlanS on Jul 12, 2014 16:23:13 GMT
A fair point Alan so let me clarify why I'm confident about using it for its intended purpose: 1: It was purchased as a back-up machine in case my main lappy went west so has seen minimal use (In fact it has out-lived two laptops since I bought it). 2: It will be playing files stored on two, two terabyte WD external hard drives which hold all my media files and their back-ups. 3: The only software to be installed on the machine will be that which it needs to play those files. 4: I don't believe in chucking perfectly serviceable equipment in the bin if it is still of use and working to spec. And finally... 5: Last December the netbooks hard drive failed, However because I had the foresight to take out an extended warranty, which I renewed a couple of years ago, the servicing company installed a new one for me and also replaced the screen as it had a patch of dead pixels down in the bottom, lefthand corner. I think that just about covers it... So thats sorted then. Lets hope all those with less foresight and good fortune are equally free from grief
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Post by MartinT on Jul 14, 2014 7:27:46 GMT
For interest, I have just put a Samsung 830 SSD into an old Samsung N210 Plus netbook. For a laugh, I put W8.1 on it too, to see if it would work. It found all the drivers (including graphics, usually the stumbling block for older machines) and installed perfectly. It's pretty fast and very stable. Impressive!
This one is going back to my partner's daughter, but it would make a very nice music server.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2014 9:21:54 GMT
For interest, I have just put a Samsung 830 SSD into an old Samsung N210 Plus netbook. For a laugh, I put W8.1 on it too, to see if it would work. It found all the drivers (including graphics, usually the stumbling block for older machines) and installed perfectly. It's pretty fast and very stable. Impressive! This one is going back to my partner's daughter, but it would make a very nice music server. how much faster? I have an old n210 which struggles to prove it's useful.....It sounds like it's worth a try, except by the time one has bought the win8.1 and the ssd you're competing with the price of a higher spec m/c with win8 already loaded at the local cash converters.... just sayin... re as a server, any netbook is going to have a better spec than most of the NAS units that people are using so they must be worth a try....
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Post by MartinT on Jul 14, 2014 9:40:36 GMT
It's subjective, but the answer is: very much faster. Like you, this N210 was virtually junk with its performance from a rotating HD and W7. With an SSD and W8.1, it is transformed into a very capable laptop. W8.1 and SSDs are very much optimised for each other, and the hardware is basically competent.
As for cost, I have a Microsoft Volume Licence agreement at work which allows me to install anything on any machine of mine (I get MSDN and software assurance, too). Sorry, but that makes it easy for me to experiment with things that most people won't normally so.
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Post by Dave on Jul 14, 2014 9:46:14 GMT
Sounds like it is worth a shot then. The next issue for me will be to try to configure Linux to output HD audio through the machines USB ports, something I've never managed to achieve on my main machine, although this is likely due to my lack of experience with the OS.
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Post by MartinT on Jul 14, 2014 9:55:40 GMT
Now then, reconfiguring a netbook with an SSD and Linux makes a lot of sense.
If anyone is looking for an inexpensive SSD to play with, the Sandisk range are fine, I have had one running in an auxiliary computer for a couple of years. Performance is good.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2014 10:13:02 GMT
Now then, reconfiguring a netbook with an SSD and Linux makes a lot of sense. If anyone is looking for an inexpensive SSD to play with, the Sandisk range are fine, I have had one running in an auxiliary computer for a couple of years. Performance is good. +1 SSDs are way cool! I had to rebuild my studio machine about 12 months ago(new 64 bit s/w etc etc, but that's another story). Put win8 in with an SSD and first boot took 8 seconds. Now 12 months later the boot still takes 8 seconds. I'm not a fan of windows, preferring the penguin, but I really can't fault this machine with win8, no other windows m/c I've had has consistently booted so quickly over time. N.B it is a very cut down win8 with many processes removed so I'm not sure if that's relevant to 8 seconds...what is relevant I believe is the consistency over time.
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Post by MartinT on Jul 14, 2014 10:15:30 GMT
Indeed, my main machine at home is a hex-core fire breather with a Samsung 840 Evo, just about the fastest SSD you can buy for reasonable money. Boot time is <6s with W8.1 and it goes like the proverbial sh1t/shovel interface.
N.B. the secret to good consistent W8.1 performance is to run Disk Clean-up (built in) once a month and tick all the boxes.
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Post by Dave on Jul 14, 2014 10:52:12 GMT
Now then, reconfiguring a netbook with an SSD and Linux makes a lot of sense. If anyone is looking for an inexpensive SSD to play with, the Sandisk range are fine, I have had one running in an auxiliary computer for a couple of years. Performance is good. I don't see any advantage to putting an SSD in my netbook really, both external drives are traditional, mechanical drives from WD and the few extra seconds during the boot-up sequence will not be a chore for me.
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Post by Tim on Jul 20, 2014 12:38:09 GMT
I don't see any advantage to putting an SSD in my netbook really You need to try it Dave to be blunt, as it does make a difference and not just from a speed/performance angle. If you are serious about getting the best from a FBA system, it needs a bit of an investment trying things out, but I have tried pretty much all combinations of drives (SSD & mechanical), different partitions, running drives from the MOBO and powering independently with a linear PSU, USB and via a network server. Netbooks and laptops are a quick workaround and easy option for many as they have one so don't need to do much, but again they can often hamper the sonic abilities - there is far too much going on in a laptop/netbook that can have a detrimental effect on the sound, you can improve them but it takes work. Linux is a good option but not for the faint hearted as this needs some knowledge if you don't know it or patience to learn it. But a tiny footprint server running Voyage MPD (like Keith does on AoS) will raise eyebrows amongst many regarding its sound quality and cost. For me I have found the best option (and this suits my personal circumstances, YMMV) is a dedicated board running nothing except the O/S (I use a tweaked Windows 8), fanless so silent and no interference from moving parts, an mSATA SSD for the O/S and media player software (I use JRiver 17 and am still happy with it having tried many alternatives) and a mechanical HDD out of the case on a long SATA cable and powered independently by a linear supply, I use a linear PSU (or occasionally a 12v battery) for the server, I am using mains power now as battery takes too much effort and I just want to listen to the music. I run it headless via the JRiver Gizmo app on an Android tablet, I don't like to have device drivers for unnecessary things like a monitor, keyboard or mouse - its lean and to me it makes difference, again YMMV. I have yet to try Server 2012 booted from a USB stick, but that is apparently as good as it gets with a Windows setup. Using a quality board can also make a difference regarding 'noise' from low quality components. I have stopped tinkering for now and have arrived at a happy medium of sound quality vs useability, as it can be never ending. I read elsewhere you thought Foobar was better sonically than JRiver? I think you have missed something here or maybe it wasn't configured correctly, Foobar is certainly simple to use (and free), but as for audio performance you are in a minority that thinks it betters JRiver, that certainly has not been the case for me and I so wanted it to be, as I didn't want to spend the money! If you want to do it well the only advice I can give is try things out, especially if you don't want to throw a lot of money at it. I'm reluctant to get into a protracted 'advice giving scenario' and from past experience it was taking up too much of my time and the net result is often a full inbox of requests, which I don't like to ignore as its a popular choice for audio these days. I have a lot on my plate right now - later on maybe I can get into it more I did it alone by testing and reading loads on the net (there's plenty on AoS between posts made by myself, Welder and Gazjam) and the Computeraudiophile forum of course. But try stuff out before dismissing it thinking well that can't possibly make a difference . . . often it doesn't, but sometimes you will be surprised.
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Post by Dave on Jul 20, 2014 13:01:30 GMT
I appreciate you taking time out to give me some input Tim but it's Linux or nowt to be honest as I just do not have the dosh to throw at this if I am to be perfectly blunt. If needs be I will stick with my current machine which sounds great, but the idea was to set the netbook up solely as a music server as this machine is used for just about everything, whereas the netbook has been gathering dust in a corner. If, when it is set up, it sounds better than the desktop then great, If not then nothing lost
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