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Post by stanleyb on Aug 23, 2015 19:30:00 GMT
Spending £5K in a cartridge puts an awful lot of faith in the phono stage.
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 24, 2015 7:30:26 GMT
My personal take is that a £300-400 rrp mc cartridge gives me everything I need. £100 - £200 for a decent used one is just about right for me. I've owned carts up to around £1k rrp, but tbh I don't think they justified the mark-up in terms of musical enjoyment. I've tried some highly rated low-medium price MM carts, and tbh they were crap compared to mc to my ears.
Orty MC25FL, Linn Asak/VdH, Goldring Eroica LX ... they do the job and sound great - I don't feel any need for better than that.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2015 7:37:13 GMT
Where as im totally the polar opposite to you Jerry, i would never entertain an MC again.
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Post by ChrisB on Aug 24, 2015 7:39:07 GMT
I agree with Scott's view that the investment in an RCM is a good one from the point of view of extending the life of your cartridge. As you spend more on the cartridge, that RCM purchase makes more sense and begins to appear proportionately less of an expense.
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 24, 2015 7:50:25 GMT
Where as im totally the polar opposite to you Jerry, i would never entertain an MC again. Hmmm, interesting! Perhaps the difference lies in our musical preferences? I mainly (99%) listen to classical on vinyl, and most MM carts just don't give me the refinement, delicacy and 3D soundstaging that I look for. ... checking our recent LP sale threads, I don't think we have a lot in common, musically!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2015 8:01:05 GMT
Hi Jerry This what i was saying on post 17/Page 1.. I listern exclusivly to Electronic 12" Singles nothing else, if i want to listern to any old albums they are on FLAC files, ill admit my Turntable combo sounds tripe playing old LP's but this is not the TT fault because the 12" singles sound fantastic. However i spent many thousands on MC's over the years never again for me..
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Post by MikeMusic on Aug 24, 2015 8:24:27 GMT
All down to VFM and the buyer's lugholes or ego
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 24, 2015 8:31:26 GMT
Hi Jerry This what i was saying on post 17/Page 1.. I listern exclusivly to Electronic 12" Singles nothing else, if i want to listern to any old albums they are on FLAC files, ill admit my Turntable combo sounds tripe playing old LP's but this is not the TT fault because the 12" singles sound fantastic. However i spent many thousands on MC's over the years never again for me.. Ah, right, yup - I missed or forgot your previous post.
Yes, it's something I've thought for ages, but which receives short shrift from the "a good system should sound good on all music types" crowd - deluded as they are! We all choose and prioritise our systems to suit our own necessarily limited musical tastes, imo.
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Post by julesd68 on Aug 24, 2015 9:58:30 GMT
This is the issue I have with my system - I need a cart that rocks with Black Sabbath but is also refined with Rachmaninov...
My Garrott does this admirably but I would still like to try an MC one more time. If I just listened to classical I probably would have kept the MC25FL but it couldn't rock in my system.
I have one of those little Lentek head amps standing by to try with something.
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Post by MartinT on Aug 24, 2015 12:54:34 GMT
You can adjust your system's priorities according to your tastes, rather than to a preferred musical genre. My collection is pretty eclectic and features a large amount of classical and modern/rock/blues music. There is no way that I could use one type of music alone for listening tests, so I listen for characteristics instead: things like lack of tonal tilt, microdynamics, macrodynamics, detail etc.
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Post by jazzbones on Aug 24, 2015 14:37:37 GMT
Harking back to beliefs of the mid 70s into early 80s (a bygone era and when turntables ruled) the mantra, in some circles, was the order should be as follows:
Above all a very good and capable turntable motor unit. This was A MUST! Followed by a very good arm to match. The pickup itself came third in the pecking order, in other words better to have a cheaper good cartridge bolted to a very good arm rather than a very good cartridge bolted to a not so good arm. I think it was Linn themselves who subscribed to this, whats the consensus on here?
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 24, 2015 15:27:22 GMT
Harking back to beliefs of the mid 70s into early 80s (a bygone era and when turntables ruled) the mantra, in some circles, was the order should be as follows:
Above all a very good and capable turntable motor unit. This was A MUST! Followed by a very good arm to match. The pickup itself came third in the pecking order, in other words better to have a cheaper good cartridge bolted to a very good arm rather than a very good cartridge bolted to a not so good arm. I think it was Linn themselves who subscribed to this, whats the consensus on here? Linn did not subscribe to that twaddle - Linn's PR dept made it up themselves cos Linn only sold motor units and arms in those days! It's just marketing bollx.
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Post by stanleyb on Aug 24, 2015 15:52:29 GMT
Harking back to beliefs of the mid 70s into early 80s (a bygone era and when turntables ruled) the mantra, in some circles, was the order should be as follows:
Above all a very good and capable turntable motor unit. This was A MUST! Followed by a very good arm to match. The pickup itself came third in the pecking order, in other words better to have a cheaper good cartridge bolted to a very good arm rather than a very good cartridge bolted to a not so good arm. I think it was Linn themselves who subscribed to this, whats the consensus on here? Where did you get to hear that stuff from/ It couldn't have been the internet since it did not exist then. It's the first I have ever heard or read that kind of stuff. You must have misread something somewhere.
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Post by jazzbones on Aug 24, 2015 19:16:26 GMT
Harking back to beliefs of the mid 70s into early 80s (a bygone era and when turntables ruled) the mantra, in some circles, was the order should be as follows:
Above all a very good and capable turntable motor unit. This was A MUST! Followed by a very good arm to match. The pickup itself came third in the pecking order, in other words better to have a cheaper good cartridge bolted to a very good arm rather than a very good cartridge bolted to a not so good arm. I think it was Linn themselves who subscribed to this, whats the consensus on here? Where did you get to hear that stuff from/ It couldn't have been the internet since it did not exist then. It's the first I have ever heard or read that kind of stuff. You must have misread something somewhere. Just because its not on the internet does not mean to say it was never said. Do you rely on the internet for all information? I did read it in one of the hi fi mags of the time which I use to be into, and no I did not misread what was written. I can't remember titles but I have a feeling that it was one of the many now defunct ones... and I now await whats coming my way no doubt. I'm not in the habit of making things up just for the hell of it as the total number of post I make are minimal.
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Post by MartinT on Aug 24, 2015 21:12:58 GMT
Yes, I remember reading it in publications like HFA. This is why the execrable Basik cartridge proved so popular
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2015 13:23:00 GMT
Harking back to beliefs of the mid 70s into early 80s (a bygone era and when turntables ruled) the mantra, in some circles, was the order should be as follows:
Above all a very good and capable turntable motor unit. This was A MUST! Followed by a very good arm to match. The pickup itself came third in the pecking order, in other words better to have a cheaper good cartridge bolted to a very good arm rather than a very good cartridge bolted to a not so good arm. I think it was Linn themselves who subscribed to this, whats the consensus on here? Ah yes.. I remember it well... Largely marketing bollocks. I'm a big fan of MC's here. Not many MM's I've heard can come close to a good MC.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2015 14:54:38 GMT
Pickering XLZ-7500-S/PLZ can
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2015 15:21:36 GMT
It's rather similar to a MC in it's low output and low impedance. Best MM's I've heard are Ortofon 2M black, Grace F9e, Ortofon VMS30 and some versions of the Shure V15. Non have quite matched a good MC and many MM's sound rather shut in, compressed and lacking extension at the frequency extremes to me... or even downright nasty and spitty in the case of some of the budget faves..
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Post by daytona600 on Aug 26, 2015 9:44:30 GMT
I agree with Scott's view that the investment in an RCM is a good one from the point of view of extending the life of your cartridge. As you spend more on the cartridge, that RCM purchase makes more sense and begins to appear proportionately less of an expense. Used a RCM for 35years myself my local record shop let me use there Monks all the time and just got in the habit of cleaning every record before playing & replacing the inner sleeves just had one of my Spus back from denmark after seven years of use & tip still had life left on it Learned the hard way back in the day about expensive cartridges when a dealer loaned me a Koetsu ( i did not go back ) & if your phono stage is up to the task very hard to go bad to a cheaper cartridge
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Post by The Brookmeister on Oct 12, 2015 19:08:33 GMT
Spending £5K in a cartridge puts an awful lot of faith in the phono stage. 100% correct, I have the North West Analogue DH1 cart and it does not suffer foolish phono amps gladly!
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