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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 12:39:38 GMT
Is it just me or do others feel the same. Im always worried whether a certain piece of my equipment will not come back on the next time i use it.. My old Equipment has been 100% reliable for nearly 35 years, where as some newer equipment had packed up within a few years. I recently bought some Active near field monitors for the studio, I am so paranoid that these will pack up soon because i know full well they will have some kind of Class 'D' power amp in em.. I don't use them any more due to the paranoia, Im considering using a vintage amp with vintage passive speakers for peace of mind..
Does my head in.
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Post by dsjr on Jan 2, 2016 14:00:45 GMT
In theory, modern gear *should* be more reliable - in theory... My suggestion is to use the little monitors you've bought Andr'e and maybe get some clip-on ferrites to minimise and rf nasties that may come down the mains and signal leads. if they're not big, get a Roxburgh 6A filter for them - I still use these on some sources with no sonic ill effects and possible sonic benefits on the main CD player - uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/pmf6/filter-in-line-6a/dp/1101097?Ntt=RoxburghIN-LINEOne of these would work with both speakers with a little margin - I read that a filter like this should be 10 times the 'capacity' of the connected component.
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Post by Tim on Jan 2, 2016 14:30:28 GMT
I'll probably regret saying this, as it's tempting fate - but I have never had any Hi-Fi ever fail on me. The only thing in that vein were a pair of £200 Ultimate Ears 'in-ear' headphones, that were very little used and the cable packed up, with wires breaking in the middle of the run. But not really Hi-Fi, so not counted and they were out of warranty.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 14:57:15 GMT
I cant help feeling that way Tim the reason i try very hard not to buy new stuff. You cannot 100% repair the stuff like you can the old, same with modern cars, its a dealer or tough..
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:04:51 GMT
I feel older stuff is far better built unless you are talking high end. I like your plan to go for vintage amp and passive speakers. They will probably sound better and still be going when we are all gone, plus the pride of ownership is higher IMO.
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Post by MartinT on Jan 2, 2016 15:06:49 GMT
It's certainly the case that miniaturisation and running circuits and components closer to tolerance have made reliability touch-and-go and repairs generally uneconomical to perform. Compare a laptop with a tablet computer: a laptop has many failure modes which can be repaired (hard disk, screen, keyboard, inverter, RAM etc.) while a tablet is virtually scrap if it fails.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:06:58 GMT
"Progress"..... People tend to buy on price and this is where its got us. Class D and SMPSU's are much cheaper to make when made in large quantities. They also save a vast amount in shipping weight. However, they are far less reliable than the traditional techniques and vastly more difficult to repair when they do go wrong. Hence usually when anything based on class D and SMPSU's goes faulty it's a case of take it to the nearest skip as, although it cost half the price of a traditional unit, it would cost 3 x as much to repair it! Beyond Economic Repair.
I often see cheap made in China kit about which, when I examine it, I find that if I was to copy it using good quality components from major trustworthy vendors, I could not buy the components for what the original unit sold for in the shops even after the manufacturer, distributor, retailer etc have all taken their cut! And that's just the components.... the casework etc is more.
If one looks at prices in an old "Hi-Fi Yearbook" from the early seventies and then convert them to modern prices then it's shocking to the modern mind how much everything cost.... even a basic 20WPC integrated amp could be £800 in today's money! No wonder it was well made and lasted for decades.... the "el cheapo" methods, parts etc hadn't been invented so everything had to be built properly.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:15:33 GMT
I would expect a vintage amp to be less reliable. If it's been going for 35 years something is likely to fail sometime in the near future. The one piece of kit I have had problems with has been CD draw mechs - avoidable if you have files or are analogue only. Never had a failure on a modern amp (from 80's onward) but had problems with 70's product back in the day. If it is new the warranty will cover it initially - Richer sounds do extended warranties fairly cheaply (unlike others). I would point out I don't own any cheap chinese stuff or class D. However at the price they are built for disposability
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:20:19 GMT
It's certainly the case that miniaturisation and running circuits and components closer to tolerance have made reliability touch-and-go and repairs generally uneconomical to perform. Compare a laptop with a tablet computer: a laptop has many failure modes which can be repaired (hard disk, screen, keyboard, inverter, RAM etc.) while a tablet is virtually scrap if it fails. Bit like what ive just been saying to John. CDP pretty much useless these days imho, now lossless file based systems are the rage [Dunno why but i know Files/streamer sounds miles better than my CD player].. What happens when the CDP fails soon down the line, The lazer goes they aint worth bothering repairing especially when they are inferior to File based SQ imho.. Files are safe bet, the Laptop packs up the next laptop will perform in the same way,Back the HDD up you got spare its a cheaper way to get back on track. Saying all this to me its getting further & further away from the old way of what made this hobby enjoyable & exciting one of the many reasons i stay clear of relying on technology..
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:24:05 GMT
I would expect a vintage amp to be less reliable. If it's been going for 35 years something is likely to fail sometime in the near future. Obviously so but i do have a spare. which cost me a whole £25.00 other than that the second has been completely serviced all Resistors checked all caps swapped out, all transistors swapped out. Between the two they will see me out.. Tell a lie the one with 100% reliability blew the power LED about 5 years ago. Cost me £2.50 for a new Resistor & LED
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:25:18 GMT
I would expect a vintage amp to be less reliable. If it's been going for 35 years something is likely to fail sometime in the near future. The one piece of kit I have had problems with has been CD draw mechs - avoidable if you have files or are analogue only. Never had a failure on a modern amp (from 80's onward) but had problems with 70's product back in the day. If it is new the warranty will cover it initially - Richer sounds do extended warranties fairly cheaply (unlike others). I would point out I don't own any cheap chinese stuff or class D. However at the price they are built for disposability Quite likely... the point is it's been reliable for 35 years from purchase! It would also be straightforward to repair
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 15:33:44 GMT
Exactly
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 16:28:35 GMT
Id also like to point out that a vintage amp can be as "new" as 1997 today, so no need to go back 35 years. I've had a few amps from 60s and 70s without issue. Probably well over 100 from the 80s again without any significant failure.
Given the simplicity and ease of access for older kit, i would have far more faith in them:
A) to be less likely to fail B) to be cheaper and easier to fix if something does give out. C) to be likely to go on for decades once again after a service.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 1:03:48 GMT
There is a tendency to forget that for each piece of 35 year+ gear that has survived, a mountain of gear from the same period found it's way to landfill decades ago.
For all the much touted 'quality' of bygone eras, there was also an awful lot of absolute shoddy tat that would struggle to make it to market now - not necessarily because the technology would be dated but because the build quality was so appalling - and I know, I owned plenty of it.
Built in obsolescence is not some new-fangled concept, I grew up with it.....
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Post by MartinT on Jan 3, 2016 9:10:44 GMT
I remember digging into my parents' Dansette music system. What a shit circuit it had, with shoddy cheap components!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 15:47:01 GMT
Id also like to point out that a vintage amp can be as "new" as 1997 today, so no need to go back 35 years. I've had a few amps from 60s and 70s without issue. Probably well over 100 from the 80s again without any significant failure. Given the simplicity and ease of access for older kit, i would have far more faith in them: A) to be less likely to fail B) to be cheaper and easier to fix if something does give out. C) to be likely to go on for decades once again after a service. Im not going back 35 years it was just that i bought it new 35 years ago, almost everything modern i bought since broke down/failed.. I use the Hi-Fi probably more that any normal person does. As for replies from people that dont believe in old stuff because they are so brainwashed with modern Hi-Fi, i personally don't give two hoots for their comments
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 15:51:05 GMT
I'm with you, Andr'e. Far more faith in things from an era where build quality was generally light years ahead of today. I'm glad not everyone agrees because it keeps the prices affordable for those who do appreciate classics.
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Post by dvh on Jan 3, 2016 15:51:27 GMT
I had a really bad experience with a Nytech integrated; one of those '80s 'classics' that people rave on about. I bought it ex-dem, and it spent as much time in the repair shop as it did playing music. OTOH I have an Exposure pre-power combination from the '90s that (touch wood) has never had any issues. I think it's impossible to generalise.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 16:03:29 GMT
Ooh, I can sympathis. Had three issues with Nytech/Ion myself. They are also not that easy to fix when they go. Exposure has been very reliable for me, as has Naim, Nad, most Linn, Rega.
I realise some gear from yesteryear hasn't remained evergreen, but much of the stuff I see today is so flimsy I would just have no pride of ownership. Had a Sonneteer amp recently that was well put together though, so I take your point about generalisations
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 20:04:27 GMT
I used to bind on about my old Ferrograph 'F307' amplifiers, that was one nice amp, built like a tank but it was so unreliable, they must have broken down half a dozen times between em.. However i totally rebuilt both but sold them on when i decided Hi-Fi was such a boring dead end hobby to continue loosing sleep over
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